Forum Activity for @dusty

This is a very interesting thread!

I have no evidence for what I'm about to suggest, just drawing from your posts above.

I wonder if both the keys of C and D were actually regularly used in "Olden Days" (which arn't really that old - my house is the same age as the earliest dated MD). Different regions would have had different primary uses for the instrument and therefore taken tunes from differing sources.

Tunes in the key of C, the "church" key would have been more likely to be written down. Hymns would have been primarily composed on the pump organ/piano by musically literate folk and passed from community to community in written form. The first written books for MD would have come from musically literate folk, much of their material (hymns) would have been in the key of C and it would make sense to transpose folk songs for the MD into the same key for instruction.

Mountain music was more likely to be learned by ear. If you were listening to your uncle play a tune on the fiddle then you are most likely to copy it in the same key. The key of D makes sense as a base. These tunes would be passed from community to community by ear in an aural tradition and would not have been written down until outsider schollars became interested.

In some communities it is quite plausable that you could drink, dance and drone with the devil in D on a Saturday night and then chime in church with the choir in C on the Sunday morning!

Robin

Dusty'

I did say said that many folks remove the fourth string believing it is easier to play that way.

You said: That may be accurate, but a lot of accomplished players remove the double string to make it easier to bend strings.

Ummm... Hello? Isn't bending strings a method of playing them? I certainly don't go around maliciously putting bends in strings otherwise...

Personally I don't have trouble bending double strings... but then I eat my Wheaties!!

Hi D.T.

Here are some photos of the board. I simply cut it from a piece of ply. It really only took me an hour or so to build. I didn't put much time into it as I wasn't sure if it would work - but I've been using it every day for the last 9 months!

I use a strap on my MD and the board and MD sit together snuggly because of those little flanges at each end.

Robin

Dusty Turtle said:

Robin, might I ask what the dimensions of your possom board are? I had never really thought about using one, largely because I mainly play alone so volume isn't an issue. But your description makes me wonder how my dulcimer would sound with a possom board. I play with a strap and can only imagine putting a small board underneath.

D.T.

Robin Clark said:

I built a simple possum board for my MD and was very surprised at the difference it made. It has given the instrument more volume and a rounder tone. I have a strap on my MD and it holds the MD and the possum board that the MD rests on just fine - I have found no need to attach the two together. Having heard what a possum board can do, I am having a Galax style false back built onto the MD I have presently on order as I want the possum board built-in for ease of use.

Robin

I built a simple possum board for my MD and was very surprised at the difference it made. It has given the instrument more volume and a rounder tone. I have a strap on my MD and it holds the MD and the possum board that the MD rests on just fine - I have found no need to attach the two together. Having heard what a possum board can do, I am having a Galax style false back built onto the MD I have presently on order as I want the possum board built-in for ease of use.

Robin

No reason you can't put a strap on a possum board! Either gravity or a low pressure bungee or rubber band holds the dulcimer on the possum board (sometimes a wooden toggle).

Tail-end lifting when you fret near the head is caused by not having your knees far enough apart and the dulcimer placed incorrectly on your lap. The nut or first fret should be over your left knee, the other end tucked into you right hip. The dulcimer does not naturally sit at right angles to your lap.

Personally I find straps very encumbering and restricting.

D.T. One thing you might want to think about when it comes to a double back is substituting a possum board. You mentioned not playing flat in your lap, so I tried my possum board resting in a more up right angled position. It held my dulcimer securely, and did increase the sound in that position. Usually I play flat across my lap, but with it more at an upright angle it also gave me a place to rest my right arm. And a strap can be attached to the board rather than the dulcimer.

The advantage I see in the possum board over a double back is that with one possum board all my dulcimers can have a freed up bottom for an increase in volume, or not if I don't want or need the extra sound. Just a thought.

And myself on the other hand- I don't care for zero frets. They give my drones a slightly metallic sound as compared to how they sound with a bone type nut. Regardless of the fretted melody string tone, I still like the drones to sound 'non-fretted', just my own preference.
And I think a well made instrument shouldn't need a zero fret to improve intonation.

I've found that having a 0 fret improves/unifies the timbre of the open string compared to fretted strings. That is, the open string has the same sound quality as the fretted strings because the string stop is the same material in both cases compared to fret vs nut material.

I play noter and drone on unison strings though so having a different timbre on two of my strings is a noticeable problem. I suspect if I was a chord style player then I might not notice it as much because the members of the chord would be fretted more often.

I do play Galax style (but don't own a Galax instrument, yet) and the double bottom is traditional in that style. As I understand, the only real purpose is to remove the dampening effect our lap has on the back just as playing atop a resonator box (or table) would. What I wonder though is why, if we're interested in transferring vibration to the back, that we don't use a soundpost in conjunction with that false bottom.

I won't rehash the good advice others have given you, just add what I have been told:
Binding is said to protect the corner/joint from damage coming from minor impacts, besides its cosmetic function. It is the one "option" that the guy who built my dulcimer really pushed, for that reason.
Scalloped fretboards look really cool when done correctly. That is almost enough to justify them by itself.
I wouldn't rule out a builder just because they do or don't use a zero fret, it is just a differnt way of doing the same thing. I certainly wouldn't ask a luthier to add one if they don't usually use it, or delete one if they do. There are fine instruments around built both ways.
Even if there ae no luthiers at a festival, there are usually people there with a number of different dulcimers that you can see, hear, and often play if you ask nice.

Good luck!

One thing you can do is make some phone calls to some of the builders here and on ED. Talk to them about what you are looking for by way of sound and see if they can build an instrument to your needs. Some builders, like McSpadden or other factory built instruments, don't modify their design as they are looking for a certain consistency of sound. Which is understandable as they do a large wholesale business as well as retail.

Other builders will be more adaptable as to size, depth of body, woods, sound holes designs etc. Talk to them about your wants as a buyer. Let them play a few instruments from what they have in stock and see if you and the builder can come up with a mutual design.

Dusty Turtle said:

Well, I am confused, folkfan, but that's not your fault!

It's apparent that there are a lot of variables involved, which makes me even more nervous about buying an instrument from someone whose work I've never played or heard.

D.T.


folkfan said:

D.T. Remember when it comes to comparing the sounds of wood from a guitar to a dulcimer, there is a great deal more wood sounding on a guitar and the bracing is different as well. Your combination of woods can have both a bright and a mellow tone depending on the size of the instrument and where the bridge is place in relationship to the tail block. A longer VSL can have a tinny sound in the higher octaves if the construction of the instrument narrows the body out under those frets and you have a small strum hollow way out on the end of the instrument. Or you can have a shorter VSL that doesn't sound tinny as the body of the instrument is wide and deep well beyond the end of the VSL. But if the luthier has correctly placed the frets you shouldn't have a drastic sharping or flatting of notes in the higher octave. Even the same VSL can sound different based on the shape of the instrument. Is that clear, or have I just confused you????.

D.T. Remember when it comes to comparing the sounds of wood from a guitar to a dulcimer, there is a great deal more wood sounding on a guitar and the bracing is different as well. Your combination of woods can have both a bright and a mellow tone depending on the size of the instrument and where the bridge is place in relationship to the tail block. A longer VSL can have a tinny sound in the higher octaves if the construction of the instrument narrows the body out under those frets and you have a small strum hollow way out on the end of the instrument. Or you can have a shorter VSL that doesn't sound tinny as the body of the instrument is wide and deep well beyond the end of the VSL. But if the luthier has correctly placed the frets you shouldn't have a drastic sharping or flatting of notes in the higher octave. Even the same VSL can sound different based on the shape of the instrument. Is that clear, or have I just confused you????.

A double back will increase volume and might with the way you play increase it even more as both backs aren't as muffled as the bottom back is when lying across the lap.

Many makers allow the top to move more freely by decreasing the fretboard internally. They rout it out. Others will scallop. I like the full length fretboard for the bracing of the top along the complete length of the fretboard. Personal preference.

I've never had a dulcimer with a binding so I can't tell you anything about them.

Personally I like a semi gloss finish in a lacquer. The really heavy glossy coating on an instrument as small bodied as a normal dulcimer would deaden the sound, (IMO)

For my hand size I prefer a VSL just under 26inches, I had one once with a 30 inch and never could play it. I tried to learn chording on a longer VSL, but had an increased problem with my hands due to the stretch and strain, so gave up chording entirely.

I'd say go with the 1+ and 8+ if you think you'll use them.

The double back allows the back to vibrate more freely and allows a bit more volume. The scallopped fretboard would help in the same way by letting the top vibrate more. The scallops also allow you to use a guitar capo, if they are located under the area where you would capo each fret. So the scallops would have the same spacing pattern as the frets, at least up to the 7th fret. I'm not sure if anyone would capo above that point, but it's an option. There are a few other things builders do to increase volume, such as only allowing part of the fretboard to contact the top. Usually, the area towards the tuners is anchored to the top, and the other end of the fretboard is cut away to let the top vibrate free.
The zero fret is just in front of the nut. It allows the strings to be as close to the neck at the 1st fret as it would be to other frets when you press the string down to the frets. A skilled maker can adjust the nut height so the zero fret is unnecessary, but some makers use them. I have one guitar & one dulcimer with zero frets, and others without. I wouldn't order one on purpose, if your chosen maker doesn't normally use one. It does nothing to justify the expense, unless the maker doesn't want to take the time to adjust the string height at the nut. If a builder told me he wasn't willing to make his instruments play well, I'd find another maker. On the other hand, my dulcimers were both kits. The maker of a kit has no control over the abilities, or lack of abillities, his kit will recieve. I can completely understand the use of a zero fret in a kit. It's much simpler for a hack like me to get good action without ruining 2 or 3 nuts on the way. It also makes it possible to build a kit with less nut slotting tools. Again, the home hobbyist/builder is in mind here.
Binding is mostly decorative. It does seal the end grain of the wood, but I'm not sure how much need there is for it. Mine don't have it, I suspect most kit models don't.
A thick heavy finish will deaden the sound of an instrument. But a proper, thin finish can shine, it depends on the product used.
A short VSL will bring the frets closer together. If you have small hands, this makes it easier to play, if you use chords, or find yourself stretching to get your thumb on a fret far above your fingers. Playing noter style you might never see a problem either way. With a longer vsl, you have to tighten the strings to a higher tension to reach the same pitches. This extra tension makes the strings a bit harder to press to the frets, but with the action adjusted correctly, this shouldn't be a problem/ That goes back to the nut adjustment in the 1st question, plus the bridge height.
Softer woods such as spruce and cedar are pretty much the standard for most string instrument tops, with hard woods the standard for back & sides. The best thing to do is play as many dulcimers as you can to hear how the different choices affect the sound. Maple is a brighter sounding wood than walnut, mahogany or rosewood. It really comes down to what you want your new toy to sound like. Try as many as you can, and see what you like in woods, sounds and VSL's. Take your time, there's lots of choices. You wouldn't want to miss any!
Paul

Howdy folks. The one-year anniversary of the purchase of my first and only dulcimer is fast approaching, and since it appears the dulcimer is going to "stick" with me, I am already considering a second dulcimer. There are so many decent builders out there it is intimidating, but there are also a variety of design features the purpose of which is not clear to me. Please help.

a double back : My understanding is that the false or double back just lifts the "real" back off your lap so that it can vibrate better and provide more volume. Is that correct? I play with a strap around my lower back and the dulcimer tilted up slightly, not vertical like a guitar, but not fully horizontal either. So when I play the bottom is raised partly anyway. With that physical approach, would a double back accomplish anything?

a scalloped fretboard : I may be using this term incorrectly. On a guitar, a scalloped fretboard is one in which the fretboard in between each fret is scooped out so that you finger the string but don't actually press it against the wood. But I think the term is used with dulcimers to refer to a style of attaching the fretboard to the soundboard not continuously, but at regular intervals like a series of arch bridges, so that the fretboard sits above the soundboard, as in this Nicolas Hambas Concert Grand: http://www.hambasdulcimers.com/MOUNTAIN.html . What is the purpose of that feature? Does it allow more vibration of the soundboard? Does it allow sound to come out from under the fretboard? I think I saw one dulcimer that had no visible soundholes, for the holes were "hidden" underneath the scalopped fretboard. What exactly is the purpose of a scalopped fretboard?

a zero fret : I may not have sufficient understanding of physics, or maybe myears just aren'tthat discriminating, but what exactly is the purpose of the zero fret? I think I read somewhere that a zero fret allows more precise intonation than using the nut. I don't understand why that would be the case, but is that correct?

binding : most guitars have some kind of binding along the edges of the instrument, but few dulcimers do. Is this merely cosmetic? I can't think of any potential effect on the sound, but a couple of luthiers offer binding as an option.

finish : some luthiers use a lot of lacquer and create a really shiny finish. My current dulcimer was not treated in such a way. As a result, it probably gets dirtier faster, but I would think that lacquer would restrict the vibration of the wood, so you would get a clearer and maybe louder sound if the dulcimer did not have a lacquer finish. Am I on the right track?

VSL : I've heard people with small hands request shorter VSL. But what are the advantages of a longer VSL? Does a longer VSL increase the playability (is that a word?) higher up the fretboard?

Finally, this is where I think I am headed with my next dulcimer. Please scream and yell if my choices seem ridiculous. I expect to get a dulcimer with a softwood top (western red cedar or sitka spruce) and a hardwood everything else (perhaps quilted maple because I like the look). It will be a six-string with the octave on the bass string. I am hoping to get a fuller sound out of my dulcimer and think the double strings will help. And I expect to add the 1+ and 8+ frets. I can see no reason save for tradition's sake not to add those extra frets. I play chord/melody style so I don't have to worry about sliding my noter over those extra frets.

I understand we all have personal tastes, but I just want to make sure I am not going to order some kind of disaster instrument that I'll never play. And there are other variables (tuners, for example) that I haven't mentioned. If you think of any other important variables I should be considering, let me know.

Much thanks in advance.

D.T.

Awwww, man! I love wild sockeye! Orange sesame oil sounds about right; although I like both sticking a steak with whole cloves before grilling; or dusting with dill as well.

Are Honduran tamales steamed, or baked? Since we have banana leaves everywhere here, I make the Oaxacan style giant baked tamales (6" diameter x 2+ ft long) called zacahuile.

Thanks, for your efforts, Folkfan.I had indeed spent a lot of time searching the web and never found a Honduran cookbook, though you might have noticed that Ken H did indeed find me one. I like your idea of making one of my own. The fact is that my mother-in-law isn't quite as coherent as she once was, so she can't really follow a recipe. Finding a Honduran cookbook was really just a way to show her that we value her background.I've ordered the bilingual cookbook Ken H found and hopefully we'll have some nice family moments recreating some of those recipes. I think I mentioned elsewhere that around the holidays we all make Honduran tamales together (they are larger than Mexican tamales and wrapped in banana leaves instead of corn husks). Maybe we'll be able to add some other Honduran recipes to that festivity.With my wife's mother from Honduras, her father from Colombia but of Lebanese descent, my mother of Ashkenazi Jewish heritage, and my father of Scots Presbyterian/French Huguenot stock, we can spend all our time trying to honor the various ethnicities, cultures, and religions that represent our ancestry and never really satisfy everyone. Maybe we'll just develop some kind of family gumbo that has a little of everything.

If I ever get out to the"other" West Coast, I'll take you up on that!

Ah, but the beast just lieth in hiding! I discovered that there was the definitive Honduran cookbook written in 1997 and a second edition produced in 2002. It is 312 pages of bi-lingual, Honduran Spanish and English recipes, food history and more.

Thanks DT;

I was actually moderately serious. Lisa takes beautiful food photos, and a collaboration could produce a really great project whether aimed at the dulcimer community or the world at large.

I have written and self-published a couple of cookbooks in the past. Those were without photos although I did have illustrations in one of them. No matter how good the recipes are, what really sells a cookbook today are the photos. But that is also the mega-expensive part of publishing a book - quality color photo reproduction. Self-publishing on-line; where the purchaser gets a .pdf or similar file would be the simplest, least expensive option. Electronic books are becoming all the rage.

Lisa - you and I need to collaborate on a cookbook. My recipes and your photos. Maybe a dulcimer-focused cookbook. I'm a trained photographer, but you have "the eye" for food photography!!

We could self-publish online with a paid download for the whole illustrated book.

Not to get competitive with stinky cheese, but I could bring some Oka cheese, made by the monks at Oka near Montreal, which just might empty the room! On second thought, maybe we can put it in its own room.

Paul

John Henry said:

I will bring a whole 'Stinking Bishop' cheese from Gloucestershire.
JohnH

Although I haven't really joined jams since taking on the dulcimer, I used to frequent a couple on the guitar and mandolin.Without trying to mimic the language of the King James Bible, let me offer my own version of the jam circle golden rule: before playing a lick, sit back, watch, and listen. Once you understand the rules of the jam, you will know how to join it. Fitting in is always better than standing out.Other than that, keep pickin' and strummin' and smilin' . . .

Good one!

I believe that forlorn doggie was last seen in the song Life Gets Teejus, Don't It ?

Cal Tinney did a popular version in the late 1940s and Doc Watson did a live recording in the early 1970s.

Well I was not online yesterday and missed all the fun. I hope there's some Pavlova left over!

Sorry, it's "green eggs and ham" not "green eggs and spam." Dr. Seuss would never advocate canned meat.

Robin Thompson said:

Patty, you can always have diced Sp*m in an omelette-- lots of eggs with little of the canned meat product. :) I'd eat it to get one of John's VA style dulcimers!

John, we must have been posting at the exact same time! You need not join again. You are a super member and already count as 4 or 5 regular members.

We are now six new members away from 5000! Who woudda thunk it? Perhaps we'll hit our milestone on St. Patrick's Day. Look! There's a leprechaun practicing the jig he's going to dance to welcome our 500th member!

Wow, dulcimer players must be reproducing like rabbits!

And I think it's appropriate to resurrect this old thread about getting 500 members in which Rod figured so prominently as we reconfigure things for a membership 10 times that level!

Many thanks to Lisa for her vision and continued leadership here and to all the members who share their knowledge and joy of music in such a friendly manner. As I approach the fifth anniversary of the purchase of my first dulcimer, I wonder if I would still be playing without the advice and encouragement from everyone here. Heartfelt thanks to all.

5,000 strong! Let's celebrate!

How funny.

I found this too, however, it works like a charm if you use a harmonic.

David Swanson said:

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the little Intelli or Tune Tech clip-on tuners that seem so popular. I have a TT500 and while I prefer my Korg, the TuneTech is very convenient. The Korg works great but the cord is a pain. The display on the TT seems to be slower, and for some reason it is less sensitive to the A string than either D strings (tuned DAdd).

Dusty Turtle said:

The hit of the day, though, was the limberjack. He danced around while I sang "There ain't no bugs on me" and the kids couldn't get enough. Whenever I tried to stop they began clapping their hands in unison and chanting "more, more, more." Finally the teacher had to bribe them with blueberry muffins to allow me to escape and get on with my day.

I had the same experience playing my limberjacks at farmers' markets and such.
Yes, there are some small children who seem jaded and uninterested, but then you get the other ones who make it all worth while. Last summer, a group of four children, ranging from age 4 to 7 or so, stopped dead in their tracks and came running over to watch my limberjack dance. You wouldn't believe how HUGE their eyes got, like dinner plates!, and then they all started laughing and pointing in delight, and the more he danced the more they laughed. Then they started trying to dance like the limberjack, and they laughed even MORE, finally collapsing right there on the ground in a heap of child glee and belly laughs. It made me so happy ! I think that was the very best audience i ever had . :)
I love playing my limberjacks. I have five of them, all different. I may wind up with more eventually, I love them that much. Plus, they are way cheaper than banjos! ;D Here are photos of three of them.