John, that's nice of you to recommend this site to new players. Thanks!  

This is an age old discussion that has been going on for far longer than the 30 or so years I've been into dulcimers.
Is the "neck/fretboard extending beyond the sound box" what defines a mountain dulcimer? Or is it the diatonic fret arrangement? Or is it the number of strings or the double melody course? Body depth and shape? The tuning? We've debated all this forever (in a good way)  :)   With so many tweaks possible in various combos, at what specific point does an instrument change from being a zither, a dulcimer, a lute, a cigar box guitar, etc. Is a guitar with diatonic frets a dulcimer?  Is a mtn dulcimer with a calfskin resonator insert a banjo? Is a stick dulcimer really a dulcimer?- if so, is it still a 'dulcimer' if it's chromatically fretted, or not fretted at all?

"What makes something a dulcimer" has always been a complex question, especially when so many hybrid instruments come on the scene. Often it just comes down to "what to call this".

But there's no 'rule book' -except the generally accepted definitions of musical instrument categories (lute family, zither family) that we've already cited. People can declare what is or isn't a mtn dulcimer til the cows come home, but often it comes down to opposing opinions.

Marsha, what key do you want to be playing in?  Then we can tell you what tuning to use if you want to be playing with that 'medieval sounding' aeolian mode... either with or without using a capo.

There might be some confusion here between referring to "a lute" and referring to a member of the lute category of instruments... being a sound box with an attached neck and strings going over the length of both. Guitars and mandolins are in the lute family. And the zither family being a usually flat sound box without a neck, and strings going the length of the sound box. The mountain dulcimer and the hammered dulcimer are both in the zither family. (according to the Hornbostel–Sachs instrument classification system)

In that video, he is simply putting a capo on fret 1, which changes you to Aeolian mode. Aeolian mode sounds minor and gives you that 'ancient' sound that you are liking as a medieval type sound. But you can put a capo on fret 1 on any mountain dulcimer and get the same thing and play the same music he is playing in the video.... did you know that? 
Unless what you are wanting is the lute-like SHAPE of his instrument, including the neck and the bowl-like body shape. In that case there are several makers of 'stick dulcimers' (dulcimers with necks, technically making them be part of the lute family, rather than the usual zither family of instruments). Stick dulcimers can be found that are not very expensive- try searching for 'stick dulcimer' instead of 'lute dulcimer' and you may find some makers that meet your taste and your budget.

@lilley-pad , that's cool!

Adding to what Dusty said, tone can also be greatly effected by the wood thickness... not simply by the size of the sound box and its scale length.

@Dan ...what note and what string gauge do you use for a 36" scale? Surely not the usual high d note... you must be tuning to lower keys/notes?

Perhaps simply comparing the sound/tone of a shorter 23 5/16" scale McSpadden Ginger to a regular 29" scale McSpadden would answer TonyG's question. However, the Ginger is described as being tuned to the key of G, several steps higher than the standard DAA or DAd.
So, Tony asks if a different scale will effect the tone or sound... I guess part of the answer would also depend on whether you specify tuning both scales to the same notes or keys.

Incredibly talented!

With a 23" scale, you'd have to use somewhat heavy strings to keep the DAd tuning from being too floppy (especially for the middle A string). What gauge strings did you put on it for that tuning?

Try looking at these threads... (it depends on if you are trying to add a photo to a discussion post, or to your profile gallery):

https://fotmd.com/forums/forum/site-questions-how-do-i

Damon, I enjoyed hearing that music you created and watching your fishing video where you put the two together. Nice work.

I just reread this 2 year old thread from the beginning- it's got so many wonderful points of view and insights from knowledgeable folks. A good read!

I guess a lot also depended on what tuning the person liked to use... as to whether a 3.5 fret would be useful? We can't just assume they tuned 1-5-8 or 1-5-5.

Looks like a nice purchase!

You should keep in mind that your 1970s dulcimer is diatonically fretted. Many modern dulcimers have an 'extra' fret or two... most commonly a 6.5 fret. Yours does not have a 6.5 fret (which is not too difficult for a luthier to add for you if you want). This simply means that if you tune to DAd and expect to follow dulcimer tabs written for DAd tuning, you may find you are 'missing' a needed note for using that tab.
There are ways to work around that. However for now I'd suggest the easiest method is to tune to DAA instead and use tab written for DAA tuning... which usually does not call for using a 6.5 fret. Or just tune DAA or CGG and start picking out simple tunes by ear.  Have fun!

I wanted to add- Terry Wilson was very active in playing music for elderly and/or disabled folks. He was quite active in fotmd's "Dulcimer Therapy" Group , if you would like to Join that group to read all the inspiring threads there. In one of his threads in that group, he wrote the following a few years ago. I think Terry would like that I share his words here today:

"I'd sure like to see this group revived.  Senior Ministry is my heart.  I love it and participate with a passion.   I also head up our Senior Ministry at my church, with the name of SALT, which stands for Senior Adults Living Triumphantly.   And I am here to tell you, our group of approx 75 attempt to live this way every day.   We have ministries in Assisted Living Homes, Nursing homes, a Hospital, a food bank,  and a local Rescue Mission, and a Prison.   

We don't all go out and play music, in fact, I am the only one.  But we do lead bible studies, and our largest, sewing.  We distributed over 600 bags and pillows last year, and that's not counting blankets, bibs, and toiletries. 

I say all of the above, so you would know what I am all about, and it's genuine.   We have a heart for seniors.

Which leads me to say this:  "If you are considering performing at an Assisted Living Home, first, you must have a heart for it.   Compassion and passion. 

Don't wait until you are a great or even a good musician, just be willing and DO IT.   I play every week at one and every two weeks at another.   I do it all myself, except I have someone to come in and lead a 10 min. devotion.   I sing, play dulcimer, ukulele, and harmonica.  I AM NOT GOOD AT ANY OF THOSE!!!!  BUT THEY LOVE ME!!!!  Go figure, huh?   I consider myself just marginally adequate.   But my goodness, I have great fun, and it's great practice.   

Every week, one 94 year old woman will say; "We don't know what you are, but we sure do like you.  Thank you for coming."   Another lady will say: "There is no one quite like you."

One of the big differences between my ministry and others who come there is this:  I engage them.   I use them.  I encourage them to participate.  The less singing I have to do the better.

I provide song sheets to every song to hand out.  All in large print.   Take them up as each song is finished.   Can't give them to much at one time.   Even if they just look at the sheet and not sing, no matter, everyone gets one.   Their eyes tell you they want one.   I also provide hand shakers, and they love their shakers.  Great therapy.

Twice during the last 12 months I have bused the residents who participate to our church to perform for our church group.   It is a real "hoot", and they love it.  

I would sure love to hear what some of ya'll do.   I need some new stuff...

Okay, I'm off now to my "gig" with the old folks.  This morning from 10:00 until 11:00 is my time.   I'm amp't up this morning.

Thank You, Terry"

Someone just let me know that fotmd member @Terry-Wilson passed away in Oct 2023.

I am very sad to hear this, as I had many fun discussions and interactions with Terry over the years here on FOTMD. A veteran, Terry was deeply dedicated to playing music and bringing joy to older people in living facilities. He played multiple instruments and enjoyed playing songs that everyone knew and could sing or clap along with. Terry had so much positive energy that he loved to share!
Terry we will miss you.

https://www.mathewsfuneralhome.com/obituaries/terry-wilson

Note that if one assumes an average dulcimer VSL (distance from nut to bridge) of around 27", one would need an impossibly thin string to tune way up to the 'a' note above high d (designated as D4, right above middle C). I believe any string would break before reaching that high of a note at that scale length, no matter what the gauge. So, on a normal sized dulcimer, any string tuned to the note of A would have to be tuned to an A note lower than middle C (C4).

Using a low wound D bass string, and a thin (.010?) unwound middle string in high d, and another thin or medium gauge string (.012/0.13?) for the melody string tuned to A (three notes below the high d)... would enable you to play in the key of D in ionian mode in noter style.  The tuning would be best labeled as DdA (I might have mistakenly typed it as Dda).  Fretting the melody string on the 3rd fret would then make it sound like a unison tuning of Ddd.  It's like DAA but without the '5th' on the middle string. It would have a unison tuning sound like Ddd, but would also give you the three extra lower notes to play on the melody string.  (It's late and I hope I'm not confusing anything in my explanation!)

@gnelson , you could also try joining our Texas Group here and creating a new thread there asking this. The group has not been active in a while, but the members of the group would likely see or get notified of any new post there, perhaps you'll get lucky.
Remember, one has to JOIN a group on fotmd in order to read the entirety of discussions and replies in the group. (Un-joining later is easy as well.)

I remember as a teenager around 1970 the classical music station my mother always had going on the radio would occasionally play some Reich. It was so haunting and made a big impression on me.

@glowhazel may not have made any posts for several years, but they last logged in here 14 months ago. I'd imagine they are still playing music of some sort.  

I think the biggest issue in playing along in a bluegrass jam is if they change keys frequently. Assuming you don't play other instruments as well, you may opt to bring two dulcimers- one for the keys of G and A, and another for the keys of C and D. That's what i used to do for oldtime music jams. It's not hard to tune up or down by one step to do this, OR use a capo on fret1 to do it. (I used to just tune up and down between A&G, and between D&C.) Using one dulcimer and tuning up and down over multiple steps will more quickly result in breaking strings, IMHO.

Bluegrass jamming has a lot more singing though, and often the favored singing key is B-flat, which might pose a special problem for a dulcimer player. In that case you might try completely muting your strings with the left hand while strumming in a percussive way with your right hand pick... not making out-of-tune notes but instead still having fun while improving your strumming rhythm.

Dusty, that is AWESOME!  Thank you for delving into this.

hahaha Dusty!

This particular spot has very gourmet coffee, and not all that cheap. They do prepare exotic drinks like turmeric coffee and 'golden milk', etc, they do offer decaff espresso which i appreciate (after having already had my coffees at home).

Dusty, I bet the young folk listen to their playlists and also spotify on their phones with bluetooth speakers when out and about. But perhaps some of them like to leave their always-connected techy jobs and have their apartment to unwind in, all retro and low key and mid-century-modern... so they enjoy the tactile feel and sound of playing vinyl records that spin around all old-fashioned like ...and pretend to not have the constant pressures of work for an hour or two. Some of them are also into writing with typewriters, and keeping leather journals.

Yesterday my husband suggested we go to a hip coffee place that recently opened in our village. They also sell old vinyl records.
Lots of millenniums and hipsters with children go there because it's a happenin' place and they get to hear and browse 'vintage' music while sipping coffee and watching their toddlers play. Some of us seniors village residents like to go there as well, because it's relaxed and cozy, and the music choices are sometimes what we grew up with.
Yesterday, the owner (who usually makes their excellent espresso drinks), overheard a little table of us Old Folk mentioning songs we remembered, and the subject of Wooly Bully by Sam the Sham and the Pharoahs came up. Next thing we knew, the owner had secretly punched it up from behind the counter on the sound system from his phone, in all its thumping glory.

So everyone in the cafe got to see a group of grey haired Boomers doing the frug from our seats and belting out along with the song- "Matty told Hatty, 'bout a thang she saw...." and of course we all chimed in at exactly the right time (because every word and note is seared into our old brains) with "Watch it now, watch it watch it watch it!!"
We Old Geezers must have been quite a sight -but we didn't care! Which of course made it even more fun.
I imagine the owner, a wise young man in his 30s, must have felt like a cosmic puppetmaster, making us all sing and dance with a simple click of his finger on his phone, and bringing everyone there obvious joy.

@nate, I've seen well known luthiers do that in the past... only adding extra frets on the first octave, when building a new dulcimer. Like you, I thought it was odd. One time I asked and was told that most players don't play up in the second octave anyway, and also that it was tricky to get accurate tones on frets when they are so close together. Or some such explanation.

Maddie, thank you so much for donating to help keep us running.  Yes, that name is me. (I don't use my real name online when I can avoid it.)
Your donation was received!  
(and thanks John, for clarifying)

   New Year's Eve, December 31 2024....

Here's hoping all members have a safe, healthy, and productive new year for 2025...full of personal joys like music and also the joy of kindnesses to others.

Happy New Year!!!!

As Ken said, look on your computer or phone for a photo app- most of them do include an 'edit' function where you can downsize your image and then save it smaller. For Sale ads must include at least one photo of the object for sale.

From my limited experience playing the tagelharpa/jouhikko (where you press the strings with the backs of your fingers to fret notes, but there is no fretboard to press the string to), I'd guess that pressing down the strings to a fretboard that was deepened down could very easily bend the notes. Most of us are used to feeling the fretboard there with the soft pads of our fingers without necessarily 'mashing' the strings. Of course, one could also use this to purposely create bending and vibrato effects. 

I'm still not sure why scalloped frets would 'create a bigger sweet spot' between the frets (assuming one does not aggressively 'mash down' while fretting anyway). The fact that the note is created off the metal fret does not change. I always thought that scalloped frets on guitars were there to better facilitate bending the notes, as in blues or jazz playing.  ?

There are many players these days however who look for and love the traditional style of dulcimer and dulcimer playing style. Personally, I hope this beautiful dulcimer remains just the way it is without being 'modernized' (geared tuners installed and extra frets added). There will be someone to cherish it and play it in the old way.
Jud, if you are thinking about your kids dealing with it, consider tucking in a little note with the instrument explaining a few things about it that you have learned. Just a paragraph or two, would be so helpful to your kids in the future, and would help steer the dulcimer in the right direction in the future.

Susie, I never really knew Donna. When FOTMD and Donna's Psaltery forums were both on Ning servers, Donna and I compared notes once or twice, many years ago. I'm sorry you are having trouble contacting her or getting her forum to work. I wish i could do more, but alas.

Hi Susie,

I see on that site of Donna's that there are events listed from late 2023, so maybe its stil active.

I see links at the bottom of their home page to contact the owner directly- have you tried that?  Also, you can try creating a new account in oder to get in. (you could always get the admin to delete a duplicate account later once you are activated). And also- I've had trouble in years past with logging in on places online by using my Google account. Is there another choice besides using Google when logging in?

Also, you can join the builders' group here on FOTMD and get lots of help from our members who build a lot of dulcimers:
https://fotmd.com/strumelia/group/11/dulcimer-making   They are always happy to help out with advice.

-Note, you have to JOIN the group before you can post there or see all the discussion replies. And joining and Unjoining groups is as easy as clicking a button.

I've removed a few escalating personal attack posts going back and forth here, and I've locked this thread.
Folks, please stay civil and let it drop. Thanks!

I just wanted to share this lovely video to enjoy and inspire us all...
https://youtu.be/o4OlL0OpbW8?feature=shared

It's lovely! I'm amazed that it is in perfect/new condition after over 40 years. I'm thinking it deserves a case, if even just a cheap cardboard or padded gig case.

The height of the bridge and nut slots can also adjust how high or low the string action is from the frets.

It should be noted that there are members of the zither family which have raised fretboards but which are not mtn dulcimers, for example concert zithers.