Forum Activity for @wally-venable

I agree with Ken that it is good to have posts which include information about historic dulcimers and builders. 

Along that line, perhaps the one you first pointed out you might have noted that it was a J. C. Shellnutt instrument. He is arguably important because he was one of the first California revival period "manufacturers."

He originated (I think) a head design which migrated to a flood of Korean instruments sold under several names in the 1960s and 70s. It is great for cutting costs, but has too much friction in the tuners and went out of fashion before 1990 or so.

On the Pyle instrument you have cited some good cautionary advice. That was good.

I just think that you should not speculate on price, and should be very careful about suggesting suitability for beginning players or collectors.

Early bids on ShopGoodwill are no indication of what the price will eventually be. We often see Mcspadden and Folkcraft instruments starting at something like $35 and closing at $200 with shipping.

Some of us here follow ShopGoodwill every day and only seriously bid in the last few hours.

There can be a bad string, but with modern wire it is unlikely that you will ever encounter one. It would almost certainly be because of a bad winding at the loop/button bass end.

You probably have too many and/or loose turns around the pin at the tuner. It can take a while for everything to slip into place.

I only change strings when they break, unless I am salvaging an old instrument. I also stick to noter-drone DAA tuning.

Last night we watched the full program from which the langspil video on YouTube was taken. The program is about contemporary "classical" music in Iceland. 

It is a great integration of music, culture, and countryside. The level of expertise in scripting and performance is, in itself, amazing. You may not know that Iceland probably produces more skilled musicians per capita than any other country in the world. You've heard their as background on many films and videos.

There are several segments with the langspil in several settings, but that is only a modest portion of the program. The cello and percussion music takes up a lot more time. They don't mention the heavy metal and pop scene in Iceland, although that is also world class.

I was particularly enlightened by the discussion of parallel fifths singing and the use of changes in time signature on a measure-by-measure basis in folk derived music. 

If you have PBS PASSPORT you can probably stream the program for free. It is also available on pay-for-view services.

I can strongly recommend this if you are interested in music beyond the dulcimer.

The footnote to the langspil video on YouTube says:

Watch full episodes and more: http://www.pbs.org/greatperformances Instagram:    / pbsgreatperformances   Facebook:    / greatperformances   Newsletter: https://www.pbs.org/wnet/gperf/newsle... #GreatPerformancesPBS

I suggest it is misleading to say that the Langspil is a "relative" of the dulcimer. The world has many three-stringed instruments which are plucked or bowed. I'm rather certain that many of them evolved independently.

People independently invent similar objects as solutions to a common problem. Would you say the heavy wooden hammer used to drive pegs for circus tents is a relative of a war club used by indigenous people in Tasmania? There are many conflicting patents for almost any device you can think of.

The Langspil is definitely descended from the Norwegian Langeleik. Iceland was "only a few days sail" from Norway back when both were part of Denmark's viking community.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langspil

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Langeleik

There is little evidence of overlap in Viking and Pennsylvania German communities in the 18th Century American colonies, although there were many inventive minds in both.

When you visit Iceland, you learn that in the early years ALL wood came from the sea (or was imported in longships.) As a result, they lived in some comfortable houses made from sod and burned peat.

I measured the 3-fret distances on my old Folkcraft dulcimer and then made the triangular Fret Rocker shown from a piece of scrap aluminum I had on hand. 

I tested it against the Folkcraft and found that two frets were high, but not enough out that I could hear any problems.

If I was making another in that size I would increase the short side to 6 cm.

The size of a fret rocker must be appropriate to the VSL and scale. I may someday make another rocker for my 24 inch VSL instruments. Sides 10 cm, 6.5 cm and 5 cm, maybe.

There's nothing wrong with a 4-sided tool, but it is a bit harder to lay out than a triangle.

The aluminum was a thickish sheet from an old award plaque, not a bit of house siding. I roughed it out on my electric coping saw and belt sander. I did make sure to refine the straight edges by putting fine sandpaper on a cast iron plate and sliding the edge back and forth along it.

 Triangular Fret Rocker.jpg - 32KB

If you are selling them as musical instruments, the first concern should be how do they sound. If the sound isn't better than a cardboard one, they're not worth the cost of new pegs. If they don't sound better than an Applecreek 100 or a 1960s Korean one, they're not worth $100, and your labor cost probably isn't a good investment.

Prospective buyers must be given an opportunity to sit down and play them to hear their voice. Saying "I don't like the tuners" is an easy way to just brush off the vendor.

I have cardboard and Applecreek instruments for beginning classes, so I'm not knocking them.

And there's nothing wrong with wallhangers as decoration, just treat them as such on your display.

From a web search:

Where to buy pure, 200-proof food grade ethanol in California?

Buying 200 proof food grade ethanol in California is quick and easy from CulinarySolvent.com .  Use the links below to browse, no permit required to ship to California residents or businesses via FedEx Ground or UPS Ground .

-----------------------

The vendor is a distillery in Maine. Probably expensive shipping for a pint of vodka.

A "fret rocker" can be any straight edge which spans 3 frets, but not 4. The "special tools" sold for the purpose are metal plates with 4 sides of different lengths, but you can use 4 or more separate objects as well.

If you explore the guitar makers' websites you will find suggestions that a credit card, small machinist's square or "ruler", etc. are suitable for different places along the fretboard. They don't have to be metal.

You can refine a straight edge by putting fine sandpaper on a mirror and sliding the edge back and forth along it.

Actually, it should be the distance of each fret from the nut, not the spacing between the frets. Otherwise an error at one fret throws all of the higher notes off.

With regard to your tuners vs. your dulcimers, remember that each tuner design uses a mathematical model when making pronouncements. Few, if any, tell you which temperament has been used. The ones with settings for chromatic-guitar-violin-etc. might not use the same model for all of them.

Tune until you are happy, and let the rest of the world roll by.

The question of A=440 or A=437, or Bb = whatever is a separate issue. Traditionally, "real orchestras and bands" tune by ear to whatever the oboe player sounds, not just sticking to some pitch fork or reed used before coming on stage. Having "perfect pitch" can be a real handicap.

I just took another run through the linked video. 

If you primarily play in isolation, this may be something you want to consider. 

If you play with others, remember that they will probably be in different temperaments. In addition, using "pulls" and "slides" will change the temperaments. Others may be slightly out of tune by a few cents on one string. Using a electronic tuner for each string will give a different temperament than using the tuner on one and doing the others by ear.

As a former physics major, I find it interesting. When I'm a player, I use the tuner to set my bass string, then go by ear or trust the 4th fret.

I believe that the richness of an orchestral sound comes from the instruments being slightly out of phase and precise frequency.

If you want to re-fret one of your instruments, the spacing can be determined with 

https://www.thekimerers.net/brian/YAFCalc/YAFCalc.html

Drew009: I'm playing with only one finger on my right hand and may I say I'm making a lot of music. I'm looking for an adaptive pick though that would fit over my finger for strumming.

If you want to STRUM, a THUMB pick might be better than any finger pick. I Googled " pick for people with bad fingers " and got suggestions for the BLACK MOUNTAIN Spring-Loaded Thumb Pick. It's a lot more advanced than the classic metal thumb pick. 

https://blackmountainpicks.com/pages/thumb-picks

In addition to grabbing your thumb, it's fat enough to prevent most cases of "Whoops, my pick fell through the sound hole!"

Here's a picture of my choice in picks for strumming

 My Favorte Pick.jpg - 208KB

>>> I have been known to use slides to cover up mistakes! 

Me too, particularly when playing by ear.

>>> "When I discovered my fret board (also called the finger board) was badly warped..."

A dulcimer FRET BOARD is not a FINGER BOARD, as used on most other string instruments.

On violins, guitars, banjos, etc. the fingerboard is attached to the neck of the instruments and is sloped above the body. It is a separate piece. There is air between the fingerboard and the body. The bridge is a separate piece tounching the strings and body. It may, or may not, be fretted.

A dulcimer fret board is attached directly to the body (sound box) and is always fretted. If an overlay is used, it is glued in place, and the fretboard becomes a one-piece composite structure.

Fingerboards are frequently arched in transverse section, but this is not a requirement. Our fret boards are typically flat in cross section.

I am one of those who believe that a traditional dulcimer must have a one-piece fretboard, with the bridge and nut mounted directly in slots in the fretboard. In that case the bridge does not contact the body, but vibrations are transmitted through the fretboard.

Leveling of the fret tops lets us compensate for slight imperfections in the finger or fret board straightness, but, of course a straight board is always best, and it should never be warped.

I usually build with guitar fret wire, but have also used the melody-string-only staples.

Checking back, I Googled the title " Seeger, Charles, The Appalachian Dulcime r"

and got the link

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://fotmd.com/forum/download/forum_file/26262/Charles%2520Seeger,%2520The%2520Appalachian%2520Dulcimer%2520(1958).pdf&ved=2ahUKEwig8Mn_76uSAxXdCTQIHU6kEz4QFnoECBgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1oHGTowFucKHdQCaggWaPF 

which looked like it was on FOTMD.

Anyway, now the paper is exposed to FOTMD.

I had not found the Charles Seeger article before, even though it is posted on FOTMD. Perhaps it is new here.

To me, there are some interesting side issues. It barely references the Ritchie family, although it does have a photo of Jean, and mentions her husband George Pickow's instruments, not disclosing that his shop was Brooklyn, NY and his connection to Appalachia was Jean.

According to Jean Ritchie's books, Charles Seeger had collected songs at the Balis Ritchie home when she was a child. At that time there was a dulcimer in the home, and Balis was more willing to play it than to sing. Didn't Seeger ask Balis about the instrument, or did he distrust what he was told?

I believe that at the time the paper was written, Jean was in New York, playing on the radio with Woodie Guthrie and Leadbelly. She surely was crossing paths with Pete's dad.

Seeger collected a tune at Arthurdale, WV while Eleanor Roosevelt was holding a square dance there. The fiddler was from the area I pass through daily, and was well known here back in the 1960s and 70s. As best I remember, Seeger put in the the Smithsonian Collection and it was recorded by the New Lost City Ramblers as "collected by Charles Seeger," not crediting the fiddler. 

I can't put 100% faith in what he wrote about Appalachian Dulcimer history.

"As to the linguistic issue, scheiße is the German word for sh*t. Scheit in the 16th century was log or piece of wood. I think that is still the translation today according to my German friends."

I don't disagree with that, but ...

First, we are discussing early 20th Century interpretation of late 18th Century Pennsylvania German terminology, as much as academic 16th Century German German. 

Second, if you use Google Translate for the meaning of "scheit" it tells you the modern translation is "sh*t." 

Third, if you look down in a toilet, in polite Victorian terms, don't you see "logs"?

We also would have a bit of confusion if we ask Google what "dulcimer" means. I'm not sure if I would trust the Unabridged Oxford Dictionary to be clear on that.

Ken Longfield and Ken Hulme said"
"These instruments were constructed by craftsmen on an individual basis probably in home workshops. There is no record of musical instrument shops in the new world building these Pennsylvania German instruments."

I have begun writing a bit of stuff for the Nonsuch Dulcimer newsletter in Britain about making and fixing Appalachian Dulcimers. In the first piece  have written:

"Historically, the LD is not a musical instrument created by skilled luthiers. It is a folk-craft item, like a quilt or a sweater. They were made by simple crafters working with locally available materials and simple tools. That practice is still alive in the USA, along with a handful of highly skilled, but mostly self-taught shops producing high priced instruments."

and

"My guess is that the 19th Century makers were also involved in making simple furniture and other household items, and that many of the instruments were made for family members and close friends."

Before 1900, making stuff for home use from wooden boxes and branches was commonplace in farm homes. I opine that is was about as common among men as needle craft was among women. The Boy Scouts taught this level of craftsmanship to townies when I was a boy. It was a common sort of magazine or newspaper story, just as boat-building was.

On the linguistic side, "scheit" in German translates as "shit" in English. I can imagine some of us saying "This piece of shit I made works pretty well for playing on the porch, although I wouldn't recommend it for public performance."

I agree that we should try to take scheitholt out of regular polite communication, but I think it has been established in dulcimer history too long to just kill off.

I have dot placed stickers, using stationary department dots or masking tape, on one or two of the instruments I own, but if I buy a modestly priced dulcimer without dots, I usually install "real" ones at 3, 7, 10 and 14.

On eBay you can buy for $15 with delivery
20Pcs 6X2Mm Guitar Natural Mother of Pearl Inlay Fingerboard Fret Dots
That's enough 1/4" dots for 5 instruments.

I also use 1/4" "plugs" cut from some ebony I have with a cheap drill-type plug cutter in a drill press.

It is easy to install them in holes made with a 1/4" Forstner bit in a drill press if you just slack or remove the middle string.

This isn't for the faint-hearted, but an almost trivial job for any woodworker, luthier or not.

You mentioned "Low-Maintenance." Provided that they are properly set up when purchased, lap dulcimers don't need much maintenance work except when a string breaks, and if you learn to tune carefully that will not be often.

It's best to store it in a proper case, rather than a pillow case. Try to keep the case out of the rain, and don't leave it on a beach. Wiping occasionally with a soft cloth and maybe oiling the tuners every couple of years is a good idea.

The traditional dulcimer is reputed to have been kept hanging on the wall over the fireplace in a cabin which wasn't heated much in below zero weather. If well built, they are a tough as the Kentucky hill folks who owned them.

I'm assuming you didn't buy one made with faces of glued up exotic wood with wild grain or knots, or millions of sound holes, and that it has a proper one-piece fretboard and geared tuners. Buying exotic stuff is always a risk.

I first encountered Steve Smith's TABs when someone passed one out in a dulcimer workshop. The Western NC Dulcimer Collective website lists too many to count, and they are free to download. They are impressive because they include "everything" needed for a group:

• Melody in Standard Musical Notation
• Chords
• DAaa and DAdd note numbers for both noter-drone and chord-melody playing
• Note names (as letters)
• Lyrics
• Sound files (.MP3 format) to guide you on unfamiliar or tricky numbers

His .PDF files may be a bit too inclusive for easy reading by folks my age, but a group leader can use them as a source for creation of "just number TABs" and so on.

There is certainly no other single website which offers as much music for lap dulcimer players.

You have constructed an attractive instrument. That is only Part 1 of making a fine instrument. Even a very well made string instrument needs "SET-UP" after construction. "Cheap" instruments are often discarded simply because no one has done that. It usually requires less than an hour of informed action.

As Ken noted, you may need to level the frets. You might find it insightful to read one of his earlier posts on leveling - 
https://fotmd.com/forums/forum/instruments-discuss-specific-features-luthiers-instrument-problems-questions/37078/leveling-of-frets-why
 
Most of the on-line information on leveling is by guitar folks. This video is good in terms of basic technique,
Fret Leveling - The Easy Way // How To

As the video notes, you start by making sure the FRETBOARD itself is straight. Many guitar necks have a metal rod which can be used to adjust the curvature. We don't use such a device. We can usually compensate for a small bit of un-straightness in the stick through leveling. 

We also don't typically use a crosswise arch on our frets.

I'm pretty much in agreement with John, a combination of heat softening of the glue and string tension resulted in separation of the "flat head." I would guess that there is little other structural damage.

You have three clear choices, (1) a very expensive "restoration" (2) a repair to playing condition (3) giving or selling it to someone who would repair or restore it. Don't throw it in the trash, at least give it to Goodwill where it would find a new home.

McSpadden instruments can have a variety of signatures, even if factory assembled. From the shaping or the sound holes, I'd say a kit is a good guess.

It may need new "bridge", spacer, strings, and tuners, but McSpadden can readily supply them. The re-gluing is pretty much a handyman project, not lutherie, and you might want to make it a DYI job. If I was doing the repair, I'd probably keep the discoloration and the story. 

In any case, it is always a good time to get another instrument.

My 6-string conversion of an old Korean dulcimer has a "dropped" A on the middle set and a "raised" D on the base set. Otherwise it has the common, original, DAA tuning. I like it, and it the instrument I usually play.

I'm not at all surprised.

All instruments need to be properly "set up," and this is often left to the retail seller. Amateur builders often don't know how to do the simple adjustments. Many of the string instruments in charity stores are "throwaways" that people got as a gift or as so-called bargains which only need a proper set-up.

I went back to look at the photos of the spacer and fret. Someone obviously messed it up. 

Frankly, if I was dealing with this, I would remove the plastic spacer and throw it away. I would make a new spacer from hardwood or plastic. I would probably then cut a new groove to fit the width and height of the spacer closer to the zero fret. Alternately I would re-cut the spacer hole to square it up, glue in a filler block, and then cut a new slot there to fit my new spacer.

I would also reset the position of the middle string to the middle of the fretboard.

Sorry about misleading you about sloping the grooves. That applies to a nut, not a spacer. 

You don't need or want diamond files for cutting wood or plastic. I use cheap (under $5) "needle" or "jewelers" files like these.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Hyper-Tough-6-Piece-Needle-File-Set-TR17075C-0-18lbs-New-Condition/49944457?fulfillmentIntent=In-store&filters=%5B%7B%22intent%22%3A%22fulfillmentIntent%22%2C%22values%22%3A%5B%22In-store%22%5D%7D%5D&classType=VARIANT&athbdg=L1600&from=/search

https://www.harborfreight.com/needle-file-set-12-piece-56743.html

Unless, of course, you are using something like stainless steel for your nut.

Some recommend using welder's "Tip Cleaners." They provide a round bottom groove. I've tried them, but I think a ve-bottom is better.

https://www.grainger.com/product/2CYY5?gucid=N:N:PS:Paid:GGL:CSM-2295:6VHHZD:20500801:APZ_1&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=21369464100&gclid=Cj0KCQjw3OjGBhDYARIsADd-uX7vO8dMz3VBbhcAci8p5LbNQX30CoNKMvqRmH5EiefwGo4KpHnIqeYaAvrLEALw_wcB

To make the slot adjustment, I would use either a triangular needle file or perhaps a welding tip cleaning file. You can do it one string at a time by slacking the string and pulling it to one side while you file while you keep the others tight.

You want to angle the slot so that the high point is on the bridge side to preserve the VSL.

I would NOT "Cut" them with a saw.

John Knopf said "One thing I've noticed is how many of these songs dealt with disasters, death, sickness, loss of dear ones, etc."

Isn't that what a lot of current "pop" music lyrics are about? Only today it is sung in the first person, not the third.

"Today I hoed an acre of beans and split a cord of wood, I'd do the same tomorrow if the good lord said I could," isn't particularly entertaining. 

In addition to ballads, they also sang "play party songs," common hymns, etc.

Many collectors were seeking "old ballads" which "proved" connection to Elizabethan England and seldom notated the other stuff. There was political bias in the collection process.

Excellent suggestion, Ken.

Warren's phone number is on his website https://www.warrenamay.com/contact-us/

When you get the answer, please let us know what he says. I'm sure several of us who do our own maintenance will be interested in why a "bridge" might have different heights for melody and bass.

I would think the bass string might have been set higher to avoid the string buzzing on some of the middle frets. There were no standard "dulcimer string" sets in 2006 and he may not have found a really good size of banjo or guitar would string.

My primary interest in "Jewish Music" is to be inclusive in performances during holiday periods like Christmas/Chanukah and Easter/Passover. I have a number of things like The Dreidal Song in my crank organ collection along with Jingle Bells.

I wasn't surprised to find that there is a book called Union Hymnal for Jewish Worship available as a .PDF at archive.org. This was produced by American "reformed" congregations, and as a result, all lyrics appear to be in English, and some of the tunes are by non-jewish composers like Mozart. 

At a first glance you would be hard pressed to tell from a single page that it wasn't from any American protestant hymnal. They are four-part arrangements.

https://ia801507.us.archive.org/34/items/unionhymnal00cent/unionhymnal00cent.pdf

Hymnary.org has several listing for books with lyrics in Hebrew and Yiddish. One example is
https://hymnary.org/hymnal/CZNS1909

Brown University has a page on Yiddish sheet music with a lot of sheet music.
https://library.brown.edu/cds/sheetmusic/yiddish/

I found that via the Hebrew Union College page on music resources.
https://huc.edu/libraries/free-online-resources/free-online-resources-music-resources/

The resources are there.

The request was for "Jewish worship songs." A lot of the common "Jewish songs" are holiday or folk tunes.

If you are looking for TABs for music for temple or synagogue, some of us here might be able to able to make them from sheet music, but we wouldn't have that or know what to look for.

I think the loudest acoustic dulcimer I have is my Tennessee Music Box (TMB). It is home-built, and I described it in the thread

https://fotmd.com/strumelia/group/42/box-dulcimers

With the 1/2 inch plywood faces it is substantial enough to survive a lot of rough treatment. It might be used as a shield It has a screen door handle on one side so it doesn't need a case

There are very few dulcimers available with proper pickups installed for electric amplification. The piezo types - either built in or attached - will pick up both any bump on the dulcimer or sometimes other sounds not associated with the instrument such as passing trains.

John Knopf built a hybrid TMB about a decade ago. If you are buying, not building your own, at least exchange messages with him.

https://fotmd.com/strumelia/group_discuss/1018/electric-hybrid-tmb

You will occasionally encounter DAA TABs which have 6 1/2 fret notes. Don't avoid an instrument just because it has one.

Your website is informative, not just a sales piece. I like the inclusion of the videos of most of your varieties letting viewers hear them.

You should consider taking your current instrument to the shop and playing both side by side. The important thing is which one suits your ear better.

If a bridge is simply too high, you can lower it by taking it out and sanding or filing the bottom a bit. Do it a little at a time and tune and play it after each reduction.

If you have measured the bridge height and know about how much too high it is, you first pass may be a larger one, then do it a bit by bit.

If you are a "DAA" player, you tune the Bass string down the half note, then use the same "4th fret" on the Bass to get the others. (Relative tuning works similarly for other tunings.)

If you go back to Jean Ritchie's Dulcimer Book, the basic tunings were a whole step lower - Cggg, CGcc and so on, so lower tunings are more traditional.