I'm still very much a beginner in playing but the issues I had with the dulciborn have settled down, except still on the highter frets - they are still hard to play but I am mostly playing lower down. I want again to thank you all for all the suggestions and your ideas in helping me set up my instrument. I am posting a few videos for the 4th on the dulciborn and any trouble I am having is more from just still learning how to play, not the dulciborn itself. So, thanks again

Interesting - less string tension making it easier to depress the strings - Does that mean easier to depress I could have clearer tones on the higher frets? If I was in G and put a capo on the 4th fret, would the strings still be easy to depress or would it start getting more tension - again making the higher frets harder for a clear tone? Hmmmm, may need to try G or C - something lower than D, but than most all my tabs are in D and the group I play with are all in D.

So many different ways of setting up an instrument, so it's right for one's own personal preference - all very interesting.

The third hurdle was string buzzing. What was odd at first was it was erratic. I experimented with bridge height a little but the final solution turns out to be loose frets. When I inspected each fret wire I noticed slight movement of the fret within the fretboard on some frets. There appears to be drying out of the fretboard due to winter dryness and the wood is "unswelling".

This is quite common on cheaper Chinese import instruments Sam (and some more expensive ones too!). The rosewood used is often quite 'young', the fretsaw blades blunt/too wide and the humidity in China when the fretboards are made being much higher than a US winter.One fix is to use asmall drop of very low viscosity superglue (the industrial stuff that isas thin aswater and sets in 1-3 secs) run under the fret, thenpress andholdthe fret firmly down for 20 seconds or so with something like a small hammer head. You can easily re finish the fret board afterward if needed by lightly filing or sanding off any glue marks then using 000 and 0000 wire wool followed by a very light rub of lemon oil. I think I've had to do this on somewhere near 400 various Far East guitars so far as part of my job Mind you, it is also a 'trick' that I've had to use on a couple of old US pre-revival dulcimers that had the odd loose fret in order to get the fret 'singing' again.

Sam,

What a history of setting up your dulciborn and welcome to FOMD. I'm glad you found this discussion, everyone seems to love their dulciborn but a few of us have or had some issues.Christine, you will notice likes theheavier gauge strings also. Both she and Frank have some great videos playing the dulciborn and many others on this site have great videos with their dulcimers - others like me are new to playing and find so many members always ready to help.

I never would think of inserting a nail under the strings but I love that you can tune to G and with the capo able to catch most all other tunings. Makes it almost seem like the best of all tunings except, I have trouble making a clear tone on the hight frets on the dulciborn - my action is still too high. Maybe I could try this on my dulcimer, which is really easy to play with a nice low action.

Good luck with GT, I wish they could straighten out the problems they have had with the dulciborn. It sounds like you know a good bit about fretboards and adjustments. I, on the other hand am learning as I go but with help picking up some good info.

Again welcome to the site, I hope you enjoy it.

I'm glad the 12's coupled with the fret adjustment improved the twang. Good job Marg! As far as the 11's, I find them a bit too thin sounding for my style of playing. There's not a huge difference but it's enough to keep me happy - ha!

marg said:

The heavier gauge will make it a little harder to play until you get used to it, Marg. For me, it's worth the extra effort as I like the tone much better. It might be worth a try and if you don't like the stiffer action you can always change it back , right?

Christine

Going to a heavier string for the bass, does it make it harder or easier to play or is it just the tone that changes?

I changed to 12's today, that and filing the 3rd fret down just a hair I think made a difference on my twang or vibration. I got to play another dulciborn yesterday and it made the same twang as minewhen strummed up the fret board. For these two dulciborns either I need to remember to strum more toward the strum hollow or not so hard.

Thank you both Christine and Frank. I wouldn't think there was hardy any difference between an 11 & a 12 string. Is it just a bit heavier or mellow? What makes you both put 12's on the dulciborn? Just like 12's better?

Christine Shoemaker said:

Interesting, had not thought of changing the others. I have a bit of a tang from vibration when I strum fast or up the fret board- I was hoping the 12's could help with this. Would be nice to be changing strings just to try different tones. Doesn't the dulciborn make a great sound and I love the sound that comes when we slide, you have some great ones in your latest video, Winter's Delete Key.

thanks,

Christine Shoemaker said:

I use the .12's too Marg. Also, .18 plain for the middle and .28 wound for the bass. I just changed the bass today to a .29 Acoustic Silk Bronze by GHS strings. (That one doesn't come in a 28.) So far, I think I like it. It seems to have a warmer tone.

marg said:

Someone from the dulcimer group in Houston went to Gold Tone for a visit. Wayne wasn't in town but one of the tech's showed him a few dulciborns and out of 6 half were good & half were a mess. I guess we got the wrong half.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

I will try the .12's and do hope Wayne can straighten out the problems. To have so many issues with the latest shipment shows they have not made any headway.

thanks as always for your suggestions, help and ideas

Frank,

If the string size for the dulciborn for DADD - .011, .011, .016, .024w have you ever thought of trying .012's instead of .011? As you know I was having trouble setting up my dulciborn and yes I do have a bit of vibration more so when I strum fast or up the fret board- I was wondering if the strings could make a difference with the vibration? Having .011's on it, I'm sure is what gives it the nice high tones alone with the base tones but thinking it may be worth a try to put on .012's.

Any ideas or have you tried changing the string size.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

Sharon,So glad you had a good evening and the dulciborn really had the crowd excited.

If the string size for the dulciborn forDADD - .011, .011, .016, .024w have you ever thought of trying .012's instead of .011? I have been having trouble setting up the action on mine and I have a bit ofvibration - I was wondering if the strings could make a difference with the vibration? Having .011's on it I'm sure is what gives it the nice high tones alone with the base tones but thinking it may be worth a try. Any ideas or have you tried changing the string size.

I played the Dulciborn at a gig last night in a local bar. I played it with a banjo and accordion and we played some old time tunes and Irish standards, sprinkled into other repertoire. We played nothing fancy-Old Joe Clark, Drowsy Maggie-that sort of thing. There is a primal and exciting atmosphere made by the power of this instrument. It was really stirring and the crowd responded! I love it!

I agree with you Marg, there are great members here and you've all made me feel very welcome. Thanks everyone! I hope I can keep up with you and continue to generate a few WOW's every now and then!

I am very flattered that you would want tab for my originals! I'm sorry, but no, I do not have any. Honestly, after I finish writing and then recording them for memory purposes, I usually go on to the next one rather quickly and do not take the time to tab them out. I'm happy that you enjoyed "Uh-oh!". I had a lot of fun with that one. If I ever do tab it, I'll be sure to send it your way Sharon!

I love Christine's playing and her compositions. I wonder if she has tabbed any of them. I LOVE "Uh-Oh"!!!!!

So nice Christine Shoemaker has come to FOYMD and posted some of her videos, there's great members here and all interested in - all things dulcimer. In just a few days she has gotten more views than posting elsewhere and many comments alone with, quite a few WOW'S

Joy W. said:

So nice Christine Shoemaker has come to FOYMD and posted some of her videos, there's great members here and all interested in - all things dulcimer. In just a few days she has gotten more views than posting elsewhere and many comments alone with, quite a few WOW'S

Joy W. said:

Well, I'm not posting any videos either but I do enjoy listening to the ones I can fine:

Frank Ledgerwood is a member and has several videos

http://dulciborn.com/videos.html

and

"I Wonder as I Wander" A song that came out of Murphy, N. Carolina in 1933. Sung by a young Annie Morgan at a revival meeting. John Jacob Niles happened to be there and paid $.25 each time for 8 times for her to sing it for him, so he could write melody and the 3 lines. He went on to add two more versus and publish it in 1934.

there are the ones Joy W. post above and Christine Shoemaker has several

https://www.google.com/?gws_rd=ssl#q=Christine+Shoemaker%2C+dulciborn+videos

I do enjoy my dulciborn but wish the action was a bit lower so it would be easier to play the higher notes. I have had a lot of trouble trying to set it up so it would be playable.

I hope you enjoy this site, there's lots on it and many very helpful members.

thanks for the welcome, marg.

not sure what tonal differences the two designs might have - if there are any, they're probably too subtle for my ear to distinguish. and the upper register is harder to fret cleanly - not an area that the dulciborn excels.

as far as videos go, not very likely, i'm afraid. due to minimal skills i'm very reluctant to play in public. i suppose only playing in private is a bit like talking to yourself, but for now that's ok.

I see you are new to FOTMD site, Welcome and hope to see some videos soon of you playing your dulciborm.

alan kolman said:

First glad you love your dulciborn, as I do mine but still having trouble setting the action right to make it easy to play. It gets too high up on the higher frets to where I can't make a clear sound in pressing them. But, I did get all tangs & buzzes fixed by some sanding & filing. The new dulciborns don't have the early, scalloped model and I hope the fretboard warping has been taken care of. It's too bad the early, scalloped model had this problem and now is gone because it was such a nice design. Did having the scallop fretboard help with the sound? Sorry you had problems, I hope it wont be spending time in the repair shop but in your hands making great sounds.
alan kolman said:

Thank you for sending the links, Southwind was beautiful and J. Stinson's #2 looked like loads of fun.

Did you have any trouble getting your dulciborn set up? I thought I had mine playing very easy with a lot action until I felt I has hitting frets, weather from too low or just vibration of the strings - not sure so ended up raising it again. Not as high as when I got it but not easy to play higher up. I can't seem to get a clear note since it's hard to press. I still like the dulciborn and hope maybe my fingers will either get stronger or someone can find the right spot for the action, not so high but not so low I buzz.
Thanks again for sending your practice sessions, great fun watching.
Joy W. said:

Marg, you're right about the collection of dulciborn videos available on the YouTube link that you posted. The musician, Christine Shoemaker, is also a member of FOTMD, but I don't think she has been active on this website in a while. She and I have worked on some dulciborn duets together and, last summer, recorded some of our efforts at a practice session. Here are two of my favorites:

Southwind - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WaRKcaKZpkA

John Stinson's #2 -

On her YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCS9PAgUI8AfFoxZFZ_XsTcQ Christine also posted some really beautiful pieces that she plays on a McSpadden 6-string baritone.

marg said:

Frank, some dulciborn videos have just been posted. thought you may like to check them out:

they're good

marg.

Thanks,

Have a good Thanksgiving week

m.

Skip said:

Check the warranty and call the company. Once you know what they will do should give some guidance as to what to do next.

(the more you strum up the fret board, the more vibration your causing, which may make the strings contact the frets.)

Someone who has helped me in the beginning & knows Goldtone said: The dulciborn "is a guitar based, rather than a dulci based instrument. Guitars and other similar instruments have a clear picking area between the bridge saddle and the end of the fingerboard, more twangy toward the bridge. The dulciborne is much larger, more resonant , and louder than standard dulcies. Therefore, buzzes and rattles will always be more pronounced."

Could this be the case, or as the guitar center said, uneven frets?

Is this as good as they get or was I sent out one that just had a bad set up from the start & no matter what I try - doesn't seem to work?

I just don't know which way I should go with it, play as is & try not to be forceful & don't play up the fret board or contact Goldtone - and what would they do? (Would they send another, would they pay to have repair work done, would they just say - send it back?) I had thought it was a high action problem, than it was a pick up problem, now I'm wondering if it's uneven frets. How many bugs am I to work out of it before I can just start playing it?

Sorry, all very confusing & just not sure on best course of action - except maybe, become a builder quick quick.

m.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

I did the dime, nickel & they lifted the strings & were very tight, so now I'm thinking the action is too low so back I go to see about adjusting that.

Not getting the sound open but starting off with first fret on up. Will keep you posted & yes, it's an art - or many years of learning.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

Watching your videos, I see you strum close to the strum hollow or right in front of it. When I am in that area I don't get the tangs but if I was to strum up the fretboard, I start getting lots of tangs. I took the string out of the slot cut into the bone & it didn't seem to make any difference. Ny other dulcimer I can play up the fret board with no problem.

Is this a problem with the dulciborn or high frets that only cause an issue when I play close to them?

Can putting a slim under the nut take care of this without raising the action much more - highup the fret board?

marg said:

Interesting, had not thought of a problem with a slot cut into the bone. The 2 melody strings are not even down the fret board,so a little notch was place in the bone to hold in place. I don't hear a tang or chimey sound if I hit each note on it's own but when I do fast sliding the strings do ring out, how much of this is a chimey/tang & how much is the tone of the dulciborn?

How did you address your string problem to make them even & not ring out?

Should I take the strings out of the grove (both or one) in the nut & just place next to it? That also would raise it just a bit. Strange, since I have gotten the dulciborn I have been trying to lower it, now I'm raising it a bit.

Frank, you have been very helpful in all my questions. I still like the dulciborn very much, just wish I was done trying to get it set up so I could just enjoy it.

PS: the pick-up that was sent out was a little different than the one that was in it to start. The new one seem to be a bit larger & fit the slot better, had numbers on it where the older one was smaller & no markings on it.

By the time I am done with getting it set up, I should know a lot about working on the dulciborn.

Thank you, I look forward to your answers since you do know a lot about the dulciborns.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

New pick-up came & has been installed. Working well, problem with the older one, wire was not connected or was loose & becamedisconnected. now still dealing with the Action, it was lowered but a hair too low now, getting a tang. I hope it can be fixed without needing a new bone.

See photo:

thanks again for all of your in-put

m.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

Well, you got yours set up a lot faster than I did. I still have to wait for the pick up to come before I can get that in, than fingers cross - all will work & I will also be set up. The way it should have come, since I did requested a low action several times & I was told it would be low & easy to play. (The difference of the action could be the difference of the pick up - maybe they measure before the pick up than when that goes in, it's that much higher.)

I will say because of needing to address my problems, I have learned so much more about dulcimers than I knew before. You & a few of the other members have been so helpful in offering your information. Before, I didn't know about sanding the bone or how to take out a pick up or even much about a string pin. I would say GoldTone & I could call it even if after learning all of this, I was set up within 2 days, not a month.

I do hope you do continue - if not in promoting the dulciborn at lease in playing them. Yes, they do need to do a better set up otherwise they will loose any following they have with them - and they are so very different in appearance and tone. I do wish them all the best but they need to fine tune their set ups.

m.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

(either works or it doesn't -a few replaced at GT )

I talked to Nathan at GT & he led me though a few checks, Yes, they work or they don't & this one isn't so they are going to send out a new pick up. I have no idea if it worked before lowering the action since I was concerned on trying to get the strings low enough to be able to play- I didn't check the pick up until afterward it was playable.

It sure would have been nice to have received the dulciborn with a lower action & pick up working - all good right out of the box. There is such a hugh difference from the height of the action when it came & now - and as you know the tone is beautiful. I love listening to your videos you have on dulciborn.com

How are you making out with yours? I'm sure you can get your action fixed a lot quicker & better than me. Sorry I don't live closer, I may have knocked on your door for some help.

Looking forward to a new video soon with this last one you received.

Thanks for all your replies with this discussion

If you sand down the bone to lower the action, have you ever run into a problem of the pick up not working? If the bone tilts a bit should the sanded end be on some sort of slant to be flat on the pickup since the bone is tilting? I have started a new discussion with the dulcimer making group - Transducer Pickup under saddle. They have given lots of good info.

marg said:

Frank,

Sorry yours wasn't as nice as the one you played. Sounds like your action is a lot like mine was. The bone has been sanded 1/16"plus a bit more than 1/32"and a bit off the sides. It fits better in the bridge - no temp with wood shim now but still no pick up. Not sure what is going on there but the action is much better, low & no buzz - the way it should have come. We did put a notch on the bone for the melody strings, they were not equal distance from nut to bridge but ended quite far apart at bridge.

On the pick up, I'm lost as to why I'm not getting anything. I will play it for a few days than e-mail Wayne an up-date.

I really wish they can get their dulciborns problems corrected, they are such an interesting instrument - the discussions should be about the tone & volume, not the problems.

Glad the dulciborn did come and yes if shipped out to someone set up like it is, would be disappointing. Gold Tone has such a great instrument but they do need to fine tune it some. I am having some trouble getting mine set up.

Thank you for the info on saddle needs to be in contact with with pick up strip inside the bridge. It may not have gotten back all the way in after sanding or doesn't like the thin wooden shim that was place in the slot to raise the strings some because of buzzing

Frank Ledgerwood said:

(fretboard to a sloping/twisting of the fret board(sounds like the one you played),)

((for a third batch) came in that addressed the fret board issue. The probable main cause was in the scalloped fret board)

Have you received your new Dulciborn yet and does it play better?

Have you ever had a problem with the pick up - the medal part down in the bridge? Do we need to be careful when putting the bridge back in after sanding a bit to lower the action, that we don'tmess up that part of the connection to work well when hooked up to the amp? Strange that it is in the bridge, so we should make sure nothing is touching that part or would that not make any difference?

Should the bone go all the way down into the bridge or just enough to hold itself straight?

You have been very helpful Frank, I hope you can answer these concerns.

I am so new and green to anything dulcimer but enjoy the tone of the dulciborn and have listen to your videos many times.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

I had the action lowered some on the dulciborn, it's much easier to play now. May try even a bit lower but will need to watch for buzzing. Don't let the comments about high action steer you away, it's a beautiful instrument & the action can be adjusted.

I like how we can have a discussion where we can ask a question and get different feel backs (without anyone thinking we own them something), as any one member would ask another member.

I am working with Wayne @ GT & have been since before my first reply within these discussions. Wayne has been very nice with all of my questions as you have been.Thank you all for your input - and you are right - the best action height is different for each of us. I am new playing the dulcimer and most anything you have said has help.

I saw some members (in a another discussion) were talking about playing chores and developing strength in their hands besides quicker moment. I many try some of their suggestions & see if that helps to strengthen my hand for playing the dulciborn before I see to having the action lowered any. I wouldn't want to alter any of the tone, it is beautiful

I had sweet help today practicing - see photo

Hi Frank,

I missed this post of yours yesterday. But I see I have said very much the same thing about contracted out building in the Far East. I have been designing, placing orders and importing resonator guitars from the Far East for about 6 years. It is a laborious and risky process . I'm at the point where I have literally one named technician who I trust to inspect parts and undertake assembly- I do all the finishing work in my workshop which takes around 4 hours per instrument, sometimes longer. I have had around 1000 instruments across my work bench- and I'll be at it again today. The downside is it is hugely time intensive to getmy guitars right - and I couldn't live off what I earn (I don't need to, which is why no one else does what I do!!!). The upside is that I work form home when I want to and if the sun is shining I go for a bike ride and if the surf's up I go surfing I don't need to advertise,the musicians I supplydo that for me, and I always have a full order book stretching a couple of months ahead.

So Gold Tonesinconsistencies with these batches come as no surprise.

It is great to hear that you are taking the trouble to inspect and set-up the instruments you sell Frank - Good for you!!! That'ssuch an important service for musicians

Marg - The best that Gold Tone could probably manage is an inspection to check that all is well and that the instrument could be set-up for the needs of a player - there just is not the margin in this type of business for anything else at the price. Guitarists are very used to buying an instrument off the shelf and at the same time paying themusic shop's technician to set it upfor their style of playing. Even if you bought a new Martin D-28 guitar made in the USA for a retail of $2000the instrument would need a set-up!!!!!I sounds like Wayne should be able to take the action a little lower for you and show you how to change your strings.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

No, not playing the last fret but that is where was noted for taking the height. Having the action high doesn't just effect the last fret but from 10 - 11 on up and I do play these frets.

Wayne set it up for me & knew I was looking for a low action, but as you said what is low or high to one may not be for another. I just received it Friday and Wayne knows the upper frets are a problem for me, while I wait for him to get back with me - saw this discussion & jump in for info. since I knew you had one & set up dulciborns for sale thought you would have some ideas. I do think that the "typical" height for the dulciborns are to high unless you have strong hands & or been playing for many years.

I have an older dulcimer with low action & plays very easy. The dulciborn (on the upper frets), I need to press so hard for the string to reach the fret, my hand shakes. I may never get the dulciborn to play as easy as my dulcimer but at least so my hand doesn't shake. It seems if sanding is the way to go, it would need to be sanded down almost 1/16" & that much may effect the lower frets. So, in a holding period over the weekend & collecting info.

Thanks Frank, love listening to your videos

m.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

(There was talk to discontinue the Dulciborns which I'm glad didn't happen as there are many happy owners, despite the growing pains.)

Yes, I am also happy they did not discontinue the Dulciborns. They already have a beautiful instrument, just a bit more adjusting on the height and they'll have something very wonderful - there now but needs easier playing.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

(The action above the octave fret was about typical, but very playable. )

What does typical mean, the action is high?

Frank Ledgerwood said:

( It is an easy job to lift out the bone (or plastic) saddle,)

How would I do this?

First would need to move the strings, they are in pins, not even sure how to remove the pins. I have always just looped my strings around a peg -- all out in the open.

Robin Clark said:

I have a saddle like the one in the photo but not the fret board, mine is solid no openings. I took a photo today of the string height, tiny bit more than 3/16" from fret to string at last fret. I can see where it maybe wouldn't be 1/8" but not this much higher.

Frank, on the new ones coming & the one you played, about how high was the action?

Robin, thanks -

What I don't understand is if the action can be fixed by some sanding, why doesn't Gold Tone do this? The only concern I have hear has been the height of the strings, everyone loves the tone but a bit easier playing would make it my go to dulcimer.

I must confess I do not know enough about this to comment intelligently. I had a friend, who is also a Dulciborn owner, take mine in to a reputable shop in Lansing, Michigan. She asked them to lower the action. They did and it is much more playable. Beyond that, I couldn't really say how they did it.

Hi Marg,

I found this photo of a dulciborne on the internet. The saddle is sitting really high.

I know a bit about Weissenborns and a bit about dulcimers and a bit about Chinese instrument manufacture of Weissenborns - long story, but I run a small specialist guitar business and have had Weissenborns build for my businessin the past.

Original Weissenborns (1920s) have a slightly higher bridge than acoustic guitarsbut not a higher saddle (as shown in the photo of the dulciborn above). In fact, on an old Weissenborn, the break angle across the saddle is the same as a standard acoustic guitar. Here is a photo of a 1920s Weissenborn:

The high saddle on 'out-of-the-box' Dulciborns does not surprise me at all. I have seen numerous Chinese Weissenborn copies with an unnecessarily high saddle dropped into the bridge slot at the factory. It is an easy job to lift out the bone (or plastic) saddle, mark a pencil line across it about a 1/16" from the bottom, place some sandpaper on a flat surface and sand off to the line. Then re-fit the saddle and test the height of the action. Keep going as required until you get the action you want.

What does surprise about the Dulciborn is the use of a raised fretboard which requires a higher bridge? I know the raised fretboard is a significant feature of the traditional dulcimer and very useful if you are a noter drone player - but in this case it seems like over engineering as 95% of players use DAdd and chord melody playing. I think I would have tried out a lower fretboard and standard acoustic guitar bridge height rather than trying to make the instrument look like a dulcimer for no real advantage. Also I would have shaped a little relief into the fretboard and compensated the saddle. Weissenborns have no frets and a high action for Hawaiian slide guitar playing - hence the bridge is high and not compensated (no need as there are no frets). The problem with a high bridge (particularly if the saddle is then high too) is the torsional stress it places on the guitar top - you have to beef things up more thus reducing the top's ability to vibrate.There can be no 'neck set' on a Weissenborn - the top is flat from nut tobridge, so a little relief sanded in to the fretboardbefore installation of the frets would work wonders for clean playing at a lower action - perhaps this has been done by Gold Tone?

The concept is a great one - and the results seem to meet the goal of producing a louder acoustic lap dulcimer. I think I would have been a bit more radical and really thought about the instrument from a players perspective (low action, much lighter build, compensated for DAdd).

Mind you - don't take what I say as Gospel - In my opinion everything great about Appalachian dulcimer designs and playing styles had actually been perfected by 1890 And it has been downhill ever since then

Robin

Joy,

You said, you hadthe action lowered - how did you go about this? Did the Luthier sand the bottom of the bridge or saddle? Or something else? Was that all that was needed to make it very playable?

Joy W. said:

Wayne Rogers wrote & said he did play the dulciborn personally & he says it played perfectly. Is that the difference from a man's hand & a woman's? As Paula asked: 'You do need strong hands" Is this a gender issue?

Wayne said the saddle can easily be sanded down to lower, same as you so I guess I need to find someone who can do this. Hopefully that will work and I can enjoy this beautiful instrument.

If anyone know's anyone in the Houston area they have faith in, do let me know. Only place I can think of is a music store where someone there knows some about fixing dulcimers.

Joy, when you had your's lowered, how did they do it? Has it made it much easier to play now?

I wouldn't be worried if we were talking a slight adjustment of height but it is almost impossible to sound a tone on upper frets.When the string is difficult to push all the way to the fret board, it is too high & that's what this is.

I think some sanding could probably take care of it, just wonder why Gold Tone didn't do it to start with.

No, the fret board is not scalloped.

If I would get a luthier to lower the height by sanding, wouldn't that mess up the warranty? If I don't have a luthier near me, could a guitar shop or music store to do this?

The sound is so beautiful I want to be able to play the dulciborn. Thank you for all your replies, they do help in trying to decide net steps.

Frank Ledgerwood said:

Thanks, that's a lots of info, but this dulciborn is new, just came & action is high - so sure if they pulled an older one that's why or if it's a newer one there is still a problem.

Luthiers guidelines include:

The string height over the 17th fret should be 1/8" for low action

But on the dulciborn is a bit more than 1/16 higher than 1/8. That'sdifference, 1/16" makes a big difference. the higher frets can not be press to the fret board.

It seems Gold Tone could when setting them up either sand the bridge down some or file notches in the bridge. I'm not asking for me to try anything but when you go & set yours up would you or could you do this if need be & if so couldn't Gold Tone also do this in setting the action?

Frank Ledgerwood said:

I have myhand shake from trying to press the strings.If the string is difficult to push all the way to the fret board, it is too high. Why would the strings be 1/16"plus higher than luthiers guidelines say? Are they set high to get the volume?

So - to answer your question, yes I have notice this action is too high & hard to press but the sound is beautiful. So how do we lower the action and does that affect the tone at all?

Paula Brawdy said:

Another question, please:

On the Dulciborn the action up toward the bridge is high. On the 17th fret where luthiers guidelines say - the string height should be 1/8" this one is a bit more than 1/16" higher than 1/8".

Should the dulciborn have notches in the bridge or should this one, or should it be lowered by sanding and why would it be so high? For the Volume

Photos showing the quarters under the strings and video showing not being able to sound a tone.

I was playing a dulciborn today and I alsolove the sound and the volume.

But I do have an issue with the hight of the strings. I was told they were low and real easy to play and they are on the lower frets but anything over 10 or 11 starts becoming to hard to press. By the time I'm up to 13, I can not sound a tone at all.

I measured the strings to my dulcimer and with a quarter at the same spot on both my dulcimer & the dulciborn around 14-15 fret, 1 quarter fit fine on the dulcimer and 2 quarters plus extra space on the dulciborn.

Would that not be high action? And why would the action be fine 1-8 only to raise up as it goes higher, shouldn't the strings be more even?

Frank & John, have you had this problem? You say you set up the ones you have, do you set them up to be lower at the higher frets also and is 2 quarters to much? Or is this how the instrument is made, to have your hand shake from trying to press the strings?

Any one with ideas, can the action be lowered up on the higher frets?

marg

Very nice playing Joy!!! And a wonderful tune you wrote too! Thank you for the information on the action and intonation issues. Both are definitely issues I'd have trouble with.

Here is a video of a song I recently wrote for the Dulciborn. It is called, "When Bears Dance" and I am playing four equidistant strings tuned DGdd.

I've had one for a while. The string action was set very high. Much too high, in fact, for me to play it. I've taken it to a Luthier and had frets added and the action lowered. Last month I had it set up so I could play with four equidistant strings and for me, it is much better that way. My instrument is not without some issues though. When I tune it, all is fine, but once I begin using frets (particularly the middle string), it is sharp. I have to do some fancy "almost in tune" tuning so that I can play without making my ears cringe. I have several other dulcimer and none have that issue except the Dulciborn.

I played a friends. You do need strong hands. It is a goldtone that she has. I think you would get used to that, but it takes a lot more hand strength due to strings being higher and just how tight the strings are. I have fairly strong hands for a woman because I play other instruments. I did love the sound and the volume of it. But haven't plunged.

I'm curious if other women noticed this?

I have watched your videos many times, they are lovely

Frank Ledgerwood said:

I would love to hear you play a dulciborn, Guy. If you & Frank can find the right one for you with low action, maybe we should start a new Interest Group.

Thanks Frank

How is the action? I tend to like instruments with a fairly low action.

I'm thinking of getting one, they sound beautiful & seem to be loud even without the hook up. Would you say yours is mellow or bright or can it be both depending on where you strum. I have watched a few video and they sound different but I'm not sure it's not the players. I don't have a collection of dulcimers, only one other so this may end up being my go to. The few people I know that have one don't seem to play their much, is it just for sometimes or could it be for all the time.

Thank you for your reply so fast.

I love mine! It is one honking instrument. Definitely a presence in a crowd. It sounds great.

WELL, I am also learning clawhammer banjo and mandolin so I don't have much time to practice. I had no trouble playing it but I am a bass player used to playing with some force. I did not notice any hard pressing necessary.

Now that you have had the dulciborn for almost 2 months, what can you tell me about it. Is the action ok & strings easy to press or do I need to work at pressing them?

Just got my used Dulciborn from eBay and it is fab! I put a lab strap on it to keep it from falling off my lap. It has volume!

Weissenborns do have hollow necks, as the sides of the guitars come all the way up to the nut area. The strings are set up very high, to keep the steel bar from hitting the fret board. You can't play them with your fingers in the normal way, you have to use the bar. But by slanting the bar, you can get notes in between the frets. The frets may be inlaid strips of wood or metal, rather than actual frets. Most lap/console/pedal steel guitars have painted on frets. The frets are only used as visual guides where to place the bar. All of this also applies to resophonic guitars, such as National and Dobro models. The "hubcap thingie" is a resonator, hence the resophonic name.(Banjo resonators are a different thingie.) I love the sound of those Weissenborns, more than the resos, and electric steel guitars, but that's just personal taste.

Paul