Forum Activity for @skip

I think many of the reasons will be be focus on tradition and your music interests which will include style of play [N/D or chording] and need for the extra frets.

It will boil down to what you want plus a bit of DAD [dulcimer acquisition disease].

I am NOT a traditionalist but I find I play mostly traditional [diatonic] music most of the time when I play with others even though my main MDs are chromatic. I use the chromatic side mostly when playing by myself.

I forgot to add, there are 'chromatic tunings' such as DAA#d, but they are 4 equi-distant strings. These are done on the standard diatonic MD.

I am looking to purchase a new dulcimer and am considering getting a chromatic.  It seems the benefits of being able to play any note within the dulcimer's range is a big plus, but I am looking for reasons why I would not want to get a chromatic.  Can anyone provide some insight here?

For instance, does having a chromatic make it more difficult to play classic dulcimer songs, is it generally more confusing, etc...?

Convince me why getting a chromatic is not the way to go, and why a diatonic is better.

Thanks!

Sorry to see the Bill Taylor tab collection is no longer available unless you are a member of the Knoxville dulcimer club. I've used it a lot in the past and am sad to have lost access to it.

Thanks Everyone, for the help. My granddaughter is a definite handful, and it is very difficult to keep her attention in one place for very long. I keep thinking that if she gives music a chance, she'll love it. I don't care if she wants to play the tuba (well, maybe I do!), but Something! I have the dulcimers so I'm going to try to start her there. I think she can get some early success which will help keep her interest. Your suggestions will definitely help guide me in this. I'll let you all know how things go. Thanks again!

Thank you Strumelia. I'll check that out.

How wonderful to see the way this all took off!  I'm just sorry I missed it somehow.  I'll put this on my calendar for next year!  Clearly I need to stay on top of things with fotmd. 

@ken-longfield  thank you for thinking of me, sir.  In these instances, where we face these immense and overwhelming circumstances, I think that it is mostly not about us at all..  we are simply being swept along by something that we cannot even create a clear conception of....  in come cases, we benefit, and it is a thing to recognize, and to be grateful for.  

So, it seems that we both have quite a bit to be grateful for.  We are fortunate.

Teddy, I thought of you at worship this morning. Psalm 30 was the appointed Psalm. I particularly liked verses 2 & 3: "O Lord, my God, I cried out to you and your restored my health. You brought me up, O Lord, from the dead; you restored my life as I was going down to the grave." These verses were particularly meaningful for me before and after my open heart surgery which was almost a year and half ago now.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

@ken-hulme  I think that I will enjoy playing in styles that are both bagpipe-like, and also entirely unlike what I already know...  that is the thing about embarking on a new thing;  the entire world is suddenly wide open to you.  I am really enjoying this already, and I haven't even received the instrument yet, lol.  Thank you so much for your help.  I have literally everything to learn.

Teddy -- Traditionally only the Melody string (or couplet) nearest to you is fretted to make the notes.  The other two strings are Drones.  If you fret the Melody string(s)  with a small finger-sized stick, we call that stick a Noter, and the style is Noter & Drone.  If you fret only the Melody string(s) with one or two fingers we call that Fingerdancing.  If you fret across all three course of strings we call that non-traditional style Chord-Melody.  For the most bagpipe-like sound you'll want to focus on Noter & Drone or Fingerdancing because they emphasize the Drones.

@richard-streib  I have been a professed monk in a monastic order for a very long time, sir.  When I was in the hospital, I often received visits from clergy and consecrated lay brothers and sisters (monks/nuns), as well as from clerics from various denominations who would come and spend a few moments with me, offering their quiet presence.  During the months that I spend in the hospital, I took comfort in knowing that I was prepared for however things turned out.  I can affect very little insofar as how these things play out.  The priests, monks, and nuns who visited me similarly were unable to change how things turned out, though I very much appreciated their calm, quiet presence when they visited me.  I have no control over most of what takes place in my life.  I was fortunate in a way;  my decades of practice as a contemplative monastic prepared me to accept whatever life unfolded to me in any given breath-moment.  (this came as a pleasant surprise). 

I was an ordinand in my third year of seminary when I found myself going into surgery, with no certainty, and no clear idea of how life-changing the experience would be, ultimately; or whether I would have any lifespan remaining at all.

Whatever the circumstances, I am alive, I am mobile, I am not dependent upon infusions, machines, or appliances, and I am able to eat and drink and my body functions normally (mostly;  everything that was in there is no longer in there, and there is something of a 'new normal' but I will accept that with gratitude, along with whatever physical pain remains).

As I write this response (01 May 2022), I am preparing for the formal conclusion of the seminary academic program which will take place tomorrow evening.  If I am able to meet all of the academic and other requirements, I anticipate ordination to the Priesthood on 03 or 04 June of this year (I am currently a transitional deacon, reading for holy orders to be ordained as a religious-order priest ((priest-monk)) ). 

Please keep me in your prayers.  I am not entirely convinced that I am worthy of this... though I am also aware that it is not about me at all.  But, I will accept prayers in support of my vocation with humility and gratitude, sir.

Perhaps, if things go well, I will be able to return the gift of a calm, quiet presence (at the very least) to some other poor soul who is facing an uncertain future while hospitalized, and perhaps be able to provide them with some small degree of comfort in a difficult moment.  _/|\_

@ken-hulme  Thanks Ken for the article.  I like the idea of a 'stringed bagpipe' and I very much would love to be able to play the Scottish and Irish tunes that I have played on the pipes, on the dulcimer (although, there is a maxim in piping that the only tunes you still love are the ones you haven't learned to play yet, since, by the time you are able to play a tune with any competence, you have come to hate it, lol!)  I don't know what Fingerdance syle is...  but it sounds intriguing.  

Best wishes Teddy on your dulcimer journey. Thanks for your testimony of God bringing you through a very serious condition. I echo what the others have posted. When you get your dulcimer enjoy it. Ask any questions you have. We are here to support you and help you.

So sorry to see this.  Naomi gave us some memorable music along with her daughter.

Rest in peace Naomi, and condolences to Ashley and Winona.  

Welcome Home, Teddy -- in many ways!   

The good news is that you can think of your dulcimer as a sort of "stringed bagpipe"!  It has the same melody and drone setup as the GBH.  There is even a specific tuning called Bagpipe Tuning -- Ddd.  Coincidentally, the dulcimer also excels at renditions of classic Scots and Irish tunes, the Border Ballads and more, particularly when played in Noter & Drone or Fingerdance style, which emphasize the drone nature of the dulcimer.  I've been playing those ballads and tunes for decades!

To get you ready for your new "friend", here's a link to an article I wrote several years ago, called I Just Got A Dulcimer, Now What? .   It's an illustrated glossary of dulcimer tunes (so we all speak the same jargon), plus answers to many beginner questions about the tuning, playing, care and feeding of your instrument.  

Ken Hulme's "I Just Got A Dulcimer, Now What?" Article - Strumelia | fotmd.com

@john-c-knopf  Thank you, John.  Its a pleasure to meet you, sir.  I am glad every moment of every day.  Nothing is guaranteed, and anything can happen.  I plan to do my very best to make the most that possibly can out of each moment going forward, and I am really happy and looking forward to learning how to play this instrument, hearing it, admiring it, and learning about it...  and to share the journey with my fellow dulcimer players.  This is a really nice community. 

@irene  Thank you so much for your response, Irene.  For whatever reason, I am indeed still here.  I wake up on my own, no tubes, no wires, no needles, no intense pain, no deep, endless, gnawing hunger and/or thirst.  I am capable of getting up, moving around on my own, eating, drinking, using the bathroom, and feeling normal.  It was not always the case.  I have no idea why I was so fortunate to come out of a situation that didn't really offer very much hope of survival.. but, I am here, now, and in all of the infinite stream of time going forward and backward ...  and in all of the illimitable distances in this universe that we live in...  we are all here, now, together.  We are all living in the same bellybutton together, we have to help one another get through this thing...  the situation that I faced is a situation that many, many other people would have traded me for, no questions asked.  I am so very, very grateful and fortunate.  I cherish every moment.  What I know is that it never occurred to me to think, "I never got to buy that... (something)", or, "I wish I could wear my... (something) just one more time." - what I most wanted were moments with people that love me, and that I love in turn.  It is the small things that escape our notice that are so very very precious.   I am attaching a photo.  This is a photo of earth, taken by Voyager 1 about 30 years ago.  Everyone and everything that has ever been, is, and will ever be important to either of us is in this photo... 

 Pale blue dot in space earth.jpg - 24KB

@ken-longfield  Thank your for your response.  I think what speaks to me most, and what resonates with me most deeply, is a fingerpicked style of dulcimer music;  particularly older music.  That being said, however, I have no intention of entering this venture with strong pre-conceived notions at all.  I am going to maintain an open mind, try every single thing that I am capable of trying, and just enjoy the journey.  I have no stated goal, nothing that I must have a deadline for..  I just want to do it for the doing of it.  (Contrast this to learning the bagpipes so that you can pass the Pipe Major's testing of your playing and march in the band, play at bagpipe gigs, and so on.  The dulcimer is not for that... its for me...  I just want to play..  I am simply happy to be here.  I have faced my own mortality on several occasions, however, every time prior to this medical thing, I had made a conscious decision to take a risk;  by taking up arms, jumping out of aircraft, being under water, or around explosives or munitions, or, later, as a police officer, walking into situations that were inherently dangerous.  In this recent instance, I was simply living my ordinary, day to day, mundane existence...  I had just lost my cat, who was my little buddy for the past 17 years at that point...  and I was heartbroken over it, and my wife, myself and a close friend went out to dinner together as a small sendoff for a special little guy.   We ate, we were talking, and I suddenly felt a dull pain, and a peculiar wet sliding sensation, and immediately felt pretty bad... but I didn't say anything, not wanting to put a damper on the evening.  I had no idea that that moment was as crucial as it actually was.  Basically, by the time I arrived at the ER, they did not expect me to live through the night.   This was the first time I had ever been confronted with my own mortality simply when I had been living my life... not taking risks, not doing dangerous things..  just living.

It changes your perspective.  I can now answer the question (i.e., for myself;  "What is the meaning of life?" - for me, it is enjoying the passage of time.   Time is passing whether we realize it or not, notice it or not, enjoy it.. or not.   At some point, an exhale will take place, without a corresponding inhale.  This is what it is to be human.  We all face this.   The difference for me now is that I actually, truly know it... am constantly conscious of it... and know that my time is finite.   A day will come when, inevitably, I am going to die, and there is nothing whatsoever that I can do to change that.

So, one day I will die... this is true.  What is also true is that from this moment, until that moment, I am going to live.   Part of living includes making music on this new instrument, enjoying the craftsmanship of the instrument, the choosing of it... and the fellowship and community with my fellow musicians, and with all sentient beings.

I think that this is the best way to show gratitude for each moment;  by living and enjoying each moment, and by being fully and totally present to it.

@greg-gunner Thank you sir, for taking the time to reply to my post.  I am sorry that you were forced to confront such a frightening and painful illness.  I have been a fighter all of my life, involved in combat sports since I was a very young child, and I served in two branches of the United States military and have successfully completed some of the toughest training courses our military offers;  I *thought* I knew what pain was, and that I could tolerate nearly anything.  Suffice it to say that I have a very much deeper understanding of what pain is now, particularly since I refused further narcotics on the fourth day after my initial surgery.  The timing was not good, as my surgeon was out of state and for some reason could not be reached for a few days, which meant that I could not go back on the narcotic pain medications for nearly four days.  Once the *actual* pain set in..  a minute was interminable from my perspective...   so it was a real hoot for a few days.  I imagine that you are no stranger to suffering either, and I am sorry for that.

You touched on the very issue that prevents me from simply switching over to bellows blown pipes.  The belt is a problem.  I know that many dulcimer players use a strap, but, I think (hope) that it is looser, and it seems to be placed in a different spot that will not be problematic for me.

Teddy, we're fortunate to be communicating with you at all!  What a horrible experience you've been through!  So glad that you haven't succumbed to those serious infections and complications.  

Monkeying around with a new dulcimer should be fun for you.  It's really a forgiving instrument, and you get nice sounds out of it most of the time.  Best wishes, and let us know if you need help.

Dear Teddy, I have tears in my eyes after reading your post here and I can speak for others that we are grateful you survived to learn more on this old world and grateful also that you are going to learn a instrument of "old" and it will be new to you.   I love noter drone style the most, as it's the oldest style....and much can be done with this way of playing.  We will be excited when your dulcimer arrives and we want to see photos of it with you.   Many will help you on this site and surely you'll find a teacher in your area.    aloha, irene

Good luck Teddy on your dulcimer journey. Playing a mountain dulcimer is very therapeutic. There are serveral styles of playing, but as a piper you may like the noter/drone as a starting point. In that style you play the melody on one string (the one closest to you as you hold the dulcimer on you lap) and the other two or three strings act as drones. I'm sure you are familiar with it. Once you receive your new dulcimer and start playing don't hesitate to ask in the forums if you have any questions. As you know by now, we are happy to offer any help we can. Best wishes.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Teddy, Welcome to FOTMD.  It sounds like you have successfully navigated your way through a serious illness.  Playing the mountain dulcimer is very therapeutic.  I have dealt with colon cancer on an ongoing basis since 2010.  The mountain dulcimer has helped me maintain a positive attitude.  

Similar to you I once played the bagpipes, although, in my case, my instrument was the Irish uilleann pipes.  Multiple surgeries have left me unable to wear the belt holding the bellows in place, so I returned to the mountain dulcimer, and it didn't disappoint.  My mountain dulcimers have provided me with many years of enjoyment.  I'm sure your dulcimer will do the same for you.

A bonus is the type of people drawn to the mountain dulcimer.  You will not meet a friendlier bunch of people.  Enjoy your instrument and don't hesitate to ask for help if and when it's needed.  FOTMD is a warm welcoming group, we are pleased you have chosen to join us.

I have belonged to this group for about two months, all the while never even once, the whole of my lifetime, having so much as touched a mountain dulcimer.  I have seen them, and heard them (while visiting family in the mountains of western North Carolina) - and that pretty much sums up my entire life experience with the mountain dulcimer; other than what I am able to see and hear on YouTube.

Yesterday was a milestone for me, in what is shaping up to be my burgeoning (solo) career with the mountain dulcimer;  I placed my order with Wood-N-Strings dulcimers for a walnut (sides,back and soundboard) dulcimer.  For the next few months, I will be anticipating its arrival, which is enjoyable in its own right, since I will only every anticipate the arrival of this dulcimer this one time.  (So I am bloody well going to savor it!)

I have literally no idea what I am doing, I have no idea where to start, and other than a few things that I was able to glean through reading posts here and on YouTube videos, I didn't really have much of a clue insofar as what my preferences in a dulcimer even were (are).

I suspect that somebody, somewhere is thinking (if they are reading this..) 'cardboard starter dulcimer' - but, nothing is foolproof, my friend;  we fools are much too ingenious for that sort've thing!!  

I live by the unwritten code;  "Anything worth doing, is worth Over-doing!!"

Although I have no idea how to even begin, in truth, I have never let that stop me in the past, and I am much, much too set in my ways to start allowing it to inform my choices today.  So, whenever my new instrument arrives, I will spend some time being utterly perplexed, and then I will decide upon a course of action, and begin.... 

Wish me luck!!  I am really looking forward to this new journey.  I am (or have been for quite some time) a piper.  A couple of years ago, however, I was afflicted by a sudden life-threatening medical emergency (my intestines spontaneously tore open... creating a 4"-6" tear... and spilling all of that nasty stuff into my abdominal cavity. 

This happened on a Monday evening...  I actually felt it occur, but, having never experienced anything of that ilk in my life, I literally had no idea what had happened.  By 10AM the next day, at work, I began having difficulty keeping my eyes in focus, and I was not able to walk down a rather wide hallway in the office without ricocheting off of both walls...   and from about 11AM(ish) I have no conscious memory to this day, until I snapped back to full awareness... sitting on my sofa.. literally pouring sweat as though someone was dumping a bowl of warm water over my head....  I crawled up the stairs..  (literally crawled.. on the floor) and was violently ill for the next hour or so.. then I dragged my sorry self to my bed where I remained (this was Tuesday night) until Thursday morning, without ever getting up at all... until my wife called Bullsh*t, and relentlessly kept at me until I very, very, *very* painfully got up, put some clothes on, and walked the longest, most excrutiating 40 feet or so to get into the vehicle, and had an exceedingly unpleasant 5 or 6 minute drive to our primary physician's office, then staggered inside.  

They put me on a table, the doctor palpated my lower left abdominal quadrant.. and I came off the table from the pain...  and was pretty much back to full awareness from that point...  the doc advised us to drive straight to the ER (she didn't feel comfortable waiting for an ambulance to come get me) they called ahead... and a few hours later I underwent emergency open abdominal surgery.  I pressed the surgeon for my chances of survival, and after me being adamant (this is my specialty), he told me that he thought I had a 15% chance of surviving the surgery, but perhaps a 1% chance of surviving the night, due to several extremely virulent and advanced bacterial infections leading to sepsis.

Several months later I returned for a scheduled second surgery, which had some severe complications.  I ended up unable to eat or drink anything for seven months ( I lived on infusions ), and then the pandemic hit, and I live in what was, at the time, the epicenter of COVID in the United States.. so it wasn't looking good.

By the grace of God, I am alive, I am relatively well, but I will probably not be able to play bagpipes again due to the internal pressure that the blowing causes.   This was not good news to me, and I will perhaps look into playing bellows blown pipes at some point... but, this new instrument is a direct result of all of this.   My hope is to be able to sit quietly, and simply play some music.  I have no interest in playing for audiences... I just want to be able to play something lovely.

So... now the wait begins.   Approximately four months was the anticipated waiting period.  I generally add some time to these estimates, because life happens.  

I am excited!!  Wish me luck!!  Perhaps I might even be able to actually learn to play this thing!!  :)

Most of the dulcimer makers in Watauga County, NC can be tied together in some manner.  The interconnections through a common practice of the late 19th and early 20 centuries (marriage of first cousins) makes family ties a complex web of who's related to who.  I'd estimate that 90-95% of Watauga County's dulcimer makers can be traced back to the common ancestors James Andrew Presnell and Susan Hartzel Benfield.  They had at least nine known children.  The descendants of those nine children make up the bulk of Watauga County's known dulcimer makers, including all the Hicks, Presnells, Wards, Glenns, Harmons, Testers, Proffitts, etc.  The dulcimer traditions of Watauga County, NC are truly a family tradition.

Greg- that terrific information to read on this beautiful dulcimer's makers!

The eagle peghead and two makers' labels puts me in mind of something else, having to do with dulcimer maker Keith Young-

Some of you may have seen some really gorgeous Young dulcimers that had an expertly carved clinging tree frog carved into the wooden peghead . When I was ordering my beautiful curly maple from Keith, I asked him about the possibility of getting it with the tree frog peghead. He told me that he himself had carved the first few frog pegheads, but that it became too much and that he had a woodcarver carve the frogs for him for a while. Eventually the carver no longer did the frogs and that's when Keith stopped offering the option altogether. So, my dulcimer has simply the elegant scroll peghead that Keith himself would carve.

This makes me wonder if the dulcimer in this thread was basically made by Hicks but perhaps David Love (as you said known for his woodworking and also making of wooden toys) carved the eagle peghead... thus resulting in the two makers' labels inside, giving them both credit for their hand in the instrument's creation?

Greg, thanks for the information on the Hicks/Love connection. I appreciate you sharing your knowledge of the Watauga County dulcimer community.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

David Love's full name was Joe "David" Love.  Like many mountaineers he used his middle name as his given name.  He learned dulcimer and banjo making from Tom "Stanley" Hicks, more commonly known as just Stanley Hicks.  The dulcimer containing maker labels for both was very likely a collaboration between the two men.  David Love was a skilled woodworker, one who made dulcimers, banjos, and guitars, as well as wooden toys.  He sold his handmade crafts through a small shop at his home.

David Love's father, Edward Miles Love, was the son of General Miles Love, who was the half brother of Millard Colfax Oliver and Smith Talbert Oliver, two names frequently mentioned when discussing the origins of the Beech Mountain dulcimer traditions.

General Miles Love was known as an abusive husband and father.  He was shot and killed by his father-in-law and brother-in-law in 1932.  The two Presnell men were defending the wife of General Miles Love, Matilda Mae Presnell, and her children from a drunk and angry General Miles Love.

There is no evidence to suggest a dulcimer connection between David Love and his grandfather's half brothers, Millard and Smith Oliver.  The available evidence suggests collaboration and possible mentorship between Stanley Hicks and David Love.

Jost, in theory you could tune any guitar like this, but I am using a guitar specifically made to be a baritone.  It has extra heavy strings and extra bracing and a strong truss rod to be able to handle the extra tension.  I would be wary of just stringing any old guitar like this.  Without that extra bracing, you might do some damage.  I am certainly no expert on instrument design, however.  The strings mine came with range from .016 to .070.  They are pretty big and give my fingers a workout.  

Thanks for the explanation Dusty, so any guitar could be retuned like this? The Sound is lovely

Very useful if you sing in a lower key. My long neck banjos are baritone. 30" scale dulcimers make great baritones. .. Robert

Yes, a baritone is tuned a 4th or 5th lower than a standard guitar.  So the low 6th string of a standard guitar is the same note as the 5th string of a baritone.  A standard guitar is tuned (from low to high) E-A-D-G-B-E whereas a baritone is tuned B-E-A-D-F#-B.

It's basically the same difference as that between a standard and baritone dulcimer.

What's the difference to a normal guitar? The tuning?

Just got a baritone guitar!  Does anyone else play a baritone guitar?  What styles of music or specific songs seem to work well?

What happened to the dulcimer clubs in the Pineville/Alexandria area? A small group meets in Lafayette on 1st and 3rd Saturday at 10AM at Jean Lafitte National Park and at the visitor's center on I-49 in Opelousas on Wednesdays at 10AM. Y'all come. 

Joe Besse

Wow!  Every forum submissison I enter becomes a gigantic learning experience for me.  I'm trying my best to follow your strumming discussion.  Thanks for expanding the topic... I need the instruction!   But, back to the original question about adding a fret:  I think I have the answer:  I'll just get another dulcimer that was built with the extra fret(s).  After all, aren't two dulcimers better than one?  Now, if I can just figure out a way to convince my wife that the banjo equation also applies to dulcimers...

Thank you both, Ken & Greg/Banjimer.  I, too, find dulcimer ideally suited to syllable playing unlike guitar which tend to be closer to "incessantly repeating a pattern."  I was fairly sure this 1/4 vs. 1/8 notes was what was happening, but thought it deserves clarification.  Our Ditties are never Bum!

Think of the "Bum" strum as a quarter note.  The "Ditty" strum is two eighth notes.  So when Ken says he's a syllable strummer, he is using the "Bum" strum for a single syllable of a quarter note duration and the "Ditty" strum for two syllables of an eighth note duration each.  

To play two eighth notes (double syllable) in the same amount of time as one quarter note the strings are strummed on both the outward and inward movement of the pick.  For the quarter note (single syllable), the strings need only be strummed on the outward motion of the pick.

Like Ken has stated, strumming well is not a matter of incessantly repeating a pattern, but rather matching a tool box of strums to the melody as reflected in the way the syllables fall in relation to each other.  Further complicating the matter are "fill notes", which can be used to extend the duration of notes longer than quarter notes.

Lois, I'm not really a bum ditty player. I'm more like Don Pedi describes as syllable player fitting the strums to the words of songs. As I understand bum ditty it is a single strum followed by a double strum. You can also do ditty bum which is the opposite; a double strum followed by a single strum. Hope that helps you.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."