Forum Activity for @dwain-wilder

Good! keep us posted on your work with this instrument. Know anything more about Davis?

Here is a tip on finding out how low to get the saddle:

First check to see that the frets are level. To do that, use a good quality set of machinist squares or combination squares. Choose sizes that will span the frets three at a time. Start with setting the blade of a square across frets 1-2-3 and see if the blade of the square rocks on the 2 fret Check on both ends of the frets and the middle.

If it does, that fret is high. Grasp the dulcimer by the fretboard (being careful not to let fingernails dig into the top!) and lift it slightly off the table so you can hammer the fret without having the top get the force of the blow.

Now give that fret a somewhat ungentle tap and test again. Remove the strings and file the fret down only if you cannot get it better seated. Then check the 2-3-4 fret, and so on up the fretboard, choosing smaller squares so the blade only crosses three frets at a time. If you don't have a square small enough to fit across only three frets at the top end, use a single-edge razor blade for a straight-edge or some other known and trusted straight edge (ground and polished machine lathe tool bits, for instance). I would not trust aluminum bar to be straight for this purpos, due to how it is formed.After you're sure the frets are all level, you're ready to see how low you can get that saddle.

Begin by replacing the saddle with the shank of a drill bit 1/64" less in diameter than its height, and tune the bass string to concert pitch, and check at each fret for buzzes. Don't worry about getting the saddle placement right during this. Keep reducing the diameter of your temporary saddle until you find some buzzes happening. Make sure the buzz isn't coming from just one fret that may be still a bit high. If you're getting buzzes from more than one fret, you now know that the saddle has to be at least 1/64" higher than that drill bit.

I like to shave floating saddles to height by putting a small plane upside down in a vice and using it as a one-blade jointer planer. You can get real fine shavings off and easily keep the bottom of the saddle straight. (By the way, make sure the area where the saddle is going to sit is flat before you start any of this work! A rocking saddle will rob the dulcimer of sound.)

Hi all,I want thank all of you for your responses,CGB is Cigar Box Guitar ,sorry I guess I am a CBGuitar guy,not to mislead you ,I am not a knowledgeable musician,but since I decided to build a guitar,I guess that makes me some kind of a musician,maybe! I am hoping it will help me,the build has taught me much,I believe the guitar will play as I’ve payed attention and learned a lot as I’ve built,as I said I have metal and wood skills and my other hobbies left me with tools,and hardware scraps to use,I have NO musical theory and music is still largely a mystery,but I know now what a scale length is,mine is 24”,and will be tuned in open G,GDG ,this guitar is actually MY teacher ,I also know frets are more than just wire and lines,as I told others,this is a new trail for me,I kind of wish I had some of my old friends who were and are musicians nearby to help .

I always made those ebony fine tuners for Walt, and still do. Message me if you need them. I also make cases that fit Sunhearths, but the are expensive and hard to find materials for. None on hand.

Shootrj2003 -- If you want a "true" dulcimer dating to 1840s there are a bare handful of photos of originals.  "True" in this case means having a central raised fretboard -- a major distinguishing characteristic which separates dulcimers from the ancestral Fretted Zithers of the Pennsylvania "Dutch" -- Germans --  who were there in PA long before 1800. 

The fretted zither plays basically the same as a dulcimer, but has a very low "staple board" on the straight near side of the body.  The photo shows a replica of one which I built from dimensions and photos supplied by the Mercer Museum in Doylestown, PA.  The instrument I replicated was made by a man named Jacob Gross, who built it sometime before 1865.  It has a traditional diatonic fret spacing, three strings, the VSL is 24", overall dimensions 4" wide and 37" long and a maximum of 3.5" high.  John and several other of our Traditional builders saw and played my replica at a Traditional Dulcemore Gathering we held in Kentucky a few years ago.

I don't know of any makers of the fine tuners on the Sunhearth dulcimers. Walt made those himself. One was missing on the Sunhearth I bought, but I had some little pieces of ebony so I made one for my dulcimer. If you send me a photo of the the fire tuners on your dulcimer and rough measurements, I can make one for you. Send me a private message here if interested. Click on @ken-longfield and then look for  send message on the left hand side of the screen

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Hello All

I took my Dulcimer to the Illinois Guitar Show over the weekend.

I had the only one there that I could find. As soon as I unwrapped it a man came right over and wanted to see it. He said years ago he made them and was impressed with the quality of workmanship and conditions mine was in. He was selling cigar box guitars now but would like to get back to Dulcimers. Most people I spoke to, had little knowledge of dulcimers, (It was a Guitar show)

I spoke to Steve Scorfina, early REO Speedwagon member, who now collects vintage Guitars, Banjos, etc. was also impressed in the quality, but never collected them because he was head deep in guitars. He was very interested in purchase and or trade buy we did not have a value to start at.

I told him the next show I attend that I know he would be at, we will talk but not seeing another one at this show and not seeing a W. Martin up for sale online, they must be special, and I would more than likely keep mine and buy a guitar from him.

So, know I am looking for a protective case to store it in.

Also, just before the bridge, there are some black sides, Is there a place to purchase them, I am missing one.

Thanks for reading along.

Bob R. 

I think the original poster meant Cigar Box Guitar, CBG and just transposed the B and G. I'll be interest to see his new cigar box creation when he finishes it.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

There are two diff ways to add pix to a post- you can try either 'attaching' one, or 'embedding' one. Check out the little buttons available in the editing box when you are typing your post- there is one for embedding pix or media.

Dwain

I think you are spot on with your guess. I need to get the bridge adjusted a little lower but changing that to the back side puts it very close to Equal temperment.   I could not see the obvious, I was getting pretty frustrated!  Thank you

Bill R

Sometimes those size estimates for uploads are 'off' . At work I can only upload 50mb or less, I often have to split pdfs and unless I split into less than 45-46mb increments they still trigger the upload cap. 

This is a weird fretting scheme. The octave (at which an instrument would have been intoned) corresponds to a scale length of 28.12". That just does not make sense in a kit.

My best guess is that the nut is misplaced. To find out if that is true, tune the dulcimer's strings so they are all correctly tuned when fretted at the octave (7th diatonic fret). Then see how well they are tuned at the second octave. Then check whether the octave harmonic tones match the fretted tones (if you're not familiar with plucking harmonic tones on a string see Guitar Harmonics w/Fretted Notes - Lick Of The Week - Guitar Lesson - YouTube). If those are not in tune with the fretted tones, move the saddle until they are.

Then check whether the fretted tone is right at each fret all the way up the fretboard. If they are all in tune then only the open string is off —meaning the nut is not in the right place. Get the nut placed so it too is in tune.

My guess is that the nut is .12" too far back. And the whole fretting job may be problematic. If you don't want to re-cut all the frets, you could simply put a piece of wire about the same diameter as the fret height and tape it in place once you've found where it sounds best with the surrounding frets and any chords of interest. Then mark where that wire touches the fretboard and make your cut there for the 6-1/2 fret.

Several of the members here (including me) specialize in reproducing old dulcimers.  They are very different than the ones you see and hear today.  Some make replicas of certain historic builder's dulcimers, while others make replicas of other builders' work.  And some now make dulcimers inspired by the old ones, but with original twists to the designs.

Some 1840's Black Powder rifle shooters are very interested in matching all of their accouterments to a specific era - thus rifle, kit, clothing, instrument must all be historically consistent. This can be difficult with instruments. I have dozens of pictures of homemade guitars and mandolins and fiddles but they all date much later than 1840. You cannot argue the existence because the photos prove that they existed. But they mostly date to 1900 or later based on the other stuff in the photo. The Museum of Appalachia has an amazing room full of homemade instruments, but, again, way newer than the 1840's.

I made a 1920's cigar box ukulele using the oldest cigar box I could find (~1964) and all American-grown wood. I even carved tuning pegs of maple from a 100-year old floor. But I cheated and used commercial frets to make it playable. It was too much work to be an ornament, and I doubted my ability to make good frets.

i am confused 🫤 i hate acronyms.

CGB = cigar guitar box? 

Ooops, I Googled CGB, but got CBG. Maybe it is a tuning for a lower voice, aeolian mode.

I would have guessed that it was a tuning, one full step down from DAC, but I Googled it.

Turns out is is "Cigar Box Dulcimer." that is an instrument with a rectangular box body and a neck. It is not a dulcimer, by our standards. And the body is probably not a real cigar box.

Dumb question maybe, but what is CGB?

What an amazing body of work you and Wayne have produced.

I’m a new CGB guy,so new I haven’t finished building my instrument to learn to play on.I do have wood and metalwork skills ,previously having built flintlock,percussion rifles of traditional style1830’s and 1840 ish.I was wish to insert a pic of 1.8 mb but it’s not allowing me even though it’s under 2.0 mb?sorry.

Hearts of the Dulcimer Podcast - Episode 60
The End

https://dulcimuse.com/podcast

This is the final Hearts of the Dulcimer Podcast episode. Thanks to David Massengill for taking us out with On The Road to Fairfax County.

https://dulcimuse.com/podcast/resource/060.html

Thanks for listening!

Patricia Delich & Wayne Jiang

I recently acquired what I believe is an all walnut  Davis kit dulcimer. 5 strings, peg tuners, 14 -1/16 inch from nut to 7th fret. floating bridge, no tag, name date etc. It was put together very well, good joints and finish .   I wish to add a 6 1/2 fret. My problem can be shown with the comparison chart I have attached showing calculated locations for JI, EqI , measured with a tape then with a 24" digital caliper. I have run the calculations from 27 to 28 1/2 " and nothing matches, but when tuned to DAd, it is good on the electronic strobe  tuner and sounds ok with my other dulcimers. I can locate the 6 1/2 fret by ear but am wondering how these frets can be vary so much yet still be in tune with equal method calculations. Any thoughts or comments?

 comparison.jpg - 77KB

Hi! Welcome to this musical crowd, ShootRJ!  We've got a lot happening on this site, as you can see!

Hello everyone,I am admittedly a cgb guy but I do like dulcimers and any of the various homemade and earthy “ mountain and folk instruments.

Another issue in making such a chart would be defining what constitutes a dulcimer builder.  In some families nearly every son either assisted his father in dulcimer making or made a single dulcimer before losing interest.  Other dulcimer makers made multiple dulcimers and taught others how to build the instruments.

The lack of surviving instruments attributed to those recalled in oral history as dulcimer builders makes one question who did and did not build dulcimers.  The Hicks family is a good example.  Several members of the Hicks family were said to have made dulcimers: Ben Hicks, Roby Hicks, Nathan Hicks, Stanley Hicks, Floyd Hicks, Windsor Canada Hicks, James Brownlow Hicks, Edd Presnell, and Frank Proffitt.

But Ben Hicks had two sons: Nathan Hicks and Samuel Hicks.  Nathan Hicks was clearly a dulcimer builder, but what about his brother, Samuel Hicks.  Did he learn how to make dulcimers?  

There is also some question as to who made the dulcimers sold by Nathan in the 1930s and 1940s.  Obviously, Nathan made most of the dulcimers attributed to him.  But oral history suggests that his father, Ben Hicks; his uncle, Roby Hicks, his first cousin, Windsor Canada Hicks, and possibly others helped him fulfill orders.

The evidence suggests the number of dulcimer builders making more than a handful of instruments was quite small.  And the number of surviving instruments can be attributed to a small number of builders.  But there were many more dulcimer builders who built only a single or limited number of dulcimers.

OK, sir, them's yer marchin' orders!  (Just kidding).

I've got the relationships for most of the Watauga County, NC dulcimer makers, but there are so many marriages of first cousins, the chart becomes too complex as the same names repeat in multiple family surnames.  All of the well-known names can be traced through marriage or birth to the family of James Presnell and Susan Hartzel Benfield.  Suffice to say, all the Presnells, Hicks, Glenns, Harmons, and even a number of Proffitts and Testers are related in some way.

Due to the large number of names it would take multiple charts to even begin a complete listing.  And that's just for the NC dulcimer makers.

I think it would be interesting if somebody (not me) made a chart linking known, historic dulcimer-building-family members.  There would be Glenns, Hicks, Presnells, Proffitts, Meltons, Russells, Mawhees, Graves, etc. included, with dozens more, I would guess.  Just a little project to pass the time away...

Any relation to Dan Hicks who is so awesome?

you either lass

You look as though you haven't aged a day, JP.   

Lady Jane

hello its me jp...anyone remember me? its been 5 years .. i gotta email from you guys today about an old post... so i thought i would stop by and see if i could help the poster...  and now i find myself looking around again ... lost all motivation on things it is a sorry thing ....

so anyway hello again

jp

Just a note, not "all" employees are recovering...

Thank you for sharing, what a great program. 

https://troublesomecreekguitars.com/

Thanks Robin for posting this.

They did mention dulcimers and student luthiers building dulcimers.

Hi friends. We are doing this beautiful piece in church. I need a dulcimer arrangement.

Thanks