Forum Activity for @ken-hulme

Having looked at the photos you posted in your other thread, Roy, It is obvious that you have a very nice older dulcemore intended only for Noter & Drone or Fingerdancing style play.  The instrument is in the style of a Kentucky or JE Thomas dulcemore with staple frets under only the melody string.   There is no 6+ fret either, again pointing to the traditional nature of the instrument

That is a very nice older "Kentucky style" similar to a J.E. "Uncle Ed" Thomas dulcemore with staple frets under only the melody string -- thus intended strictly for Noter & Drone or Fingerdancing style play.   There is no 6+ fret.

If you look through the rear sound holes with a flashlight, is there any sort of maker's label, or written name/date in the wood of the inside bottom?

Personally I would do everything possible to keep the original pegs functioning.  Although they are "in the style of" I don't believe those are commercial pegs.  

What is the VSL?  That's what we need to determine which strings you'll need.  Is the bass string wound?  It's hard to tell.  Many/most traditional dulcemores did not use wound bass strings, which contributes to the 'high silvery' sound of traditional dulcemores rather than the deeper more mellow tone of modern dulcimers.

You do not need all those wraps of string around the pegs.  Through the hole and around twice is all that's necessary; then cut of the excess to avoid birds nests in the pegbox.  

If you have a micrometer, you could mike the strings and see what is currently installed. But with the VSL and knowing you want to tune DAA, we can use a calculator to determine more exact gauges.  However, for VSLs between 24-26", a pair of plain steel .012s for the melody and mid drone, and a plain .018 or .020 for the bass are a good place to start. 

Tuning a bit sharp, with a push at the end to lock the peg is the technique I use.  Then as you play a bit the strings stretch  just a hair reducing the sharpness.  Since we mostly play solo, the exact notes of the tuning are not super critical, although too sharp or too flat don't sound very sweet together.  

Ken, I think I've now attached two photos.  Thanks for your help.

 dulcimer A.jpg - 178KB

@jost -- A transitioning guitar player has to understand that the usual flat finger type of fretting which works on guitar doesn't work well on a dulcimer flat in your lap; a more finger-tip approach is required.   I think Roy is wise to change playing style to noter as the way to transition from painful guitar to dulcimer.   Trying to treat a dulcimer as a miniature guitar can be fraught with "issues".  Learning the dulcimer as the dulcimer is traditionally played -- and then adapting some guitar technique seems best among those I know who have transitioned.

Jost, I haven't mastered chording (as opposed to the noter) or finger picking, as opposed to a pick.  Still learning to tune (see my other posts about my wooden tuner battle) and pick out tunes with a noter.  I think the distance between strings is the same on the dulcimer as it is on the guitar, but I can see needing a wider fretboard if you're used to a guitar fretboard.  I'm personally more comfortable with a 2" classical guitar type fretboard, and have found even 1/8" difference can make fretting harder.

Thanks Skip.  That's what I've been doing lately.  Very frustrating to have such a learning curve ahead of me for what should be a simple tuning process.  Used to guitars and ukuleles.  Never played violin.

Ok. I had the same slipping problem the first time I messed with wood pegs. What I found to work best for me is to push the peg further into the hole as I finished, maybe going a little bit past where I wanted to be.

Skip, to answer your question - this is my first experience with wooden pegs.  Only used to guitar type geared tuners.

Yes Ken, I'm going for at least a DAA option

 VSL is exactly 28"

I'll try to post photos later.

What is your VSL (distance between nut and bridge)?  String gauges are dependent on the VSL and the open tuning of the strings.  I take it you're trying to tune DAA.   

The age of your dulcimer isn't  really a factor; but without a photo or two we can't tell whether the builder used hand-made pegs or regular commercial violin pegs. 

I personally build several 24"-26" VSL dulcemore patterns, and use what are called 1/4 size Violin pegs and a standard violin taper reamer to taper the holes in the peghead. Those pegs are about the dimensions you mention, and they tune just fine to D and even E and high -- with appropriate gauge strings -- without any issues. 

Have you used wood pegs before? Just curious.

So I changed the (old) strings, sanded the pegs as suggested and applied a little paste.  The pegs are a bit more usable, but still won't stay put at anything above C-G-G, and even that combination is actually flat (really B#-F#-F#  - yes I know there's no B#).  Should I perhaps try lighter gauge strings?  I'm currently using D'Addario 12, 12 and 22w.  Also, my dulcimer is a hand made instrument from 1969, with what seem to be pegs on the smaller side - 2" long shaft, but a diameter of 1/4" tapered down to 3/16".  Thanks

The style also depends on your instrument and your fingers ( at least in my humble opinion). My dulcimers fretboard is quite narrow thus I plain only noter/drone style ( Sound is great!) since my fingers always touch their neighbour strings. Of course one might argue that the fretboard isn't too narrow but my fingers to thick 😀

I'm saving money for getting another one with a wider fretboard now.

So: If you are interested in a certain style it might be an idea to get an instrument designed for it.

Like Dusty I would suggest to try several style and See what fit's you best.

Just my two Cents 

Btw: I'm playing guitar ( first chord strumming, now mainly finger-picking) too. I switch Instruments when one tires my fingers out too much.

Thanks Dusty. Definitely food for thought.

@RoyB, I would encourage you to think of noter/drone play not as a beginner "stage" in your dulcimer playing but as a unique style that may be relatively easy to learn at first but still requires years of practice to master.  You might consider embracing that style and planning on developing your noter technique over time.

On the other hand, if you want to play more modern styles of music on your dulcimer, you might be able to despite your arthritis.  With five fingers and only three strings, there are multiple ways of fingering chords and playing melodies across those strings.  I have a private student who has pretty bad arthritis in 1-2 fingers of her fretting hand, and we find ways to work around that limitation, either by finding alternative fingerings or sometimes revising arrangements.

And I should add that there are some great dulcimer players who don't use their pinky at all.

My advice is to concentrate on learning the instrument and playing the music you like.  Unless your arthritis gets much, much worse, there will be work-arounds for any obstacles you encounter.

Thanks, Lois.  While I fingerpick folk music on guitar, I'm still at the noter stage on dulcimer.  Saw a doctor and am treating what seems to be an arthritic finger (ain't gettin' old great?), but I may be joining your camp - I don't know how much I want to push my luck with it.

Thank you, Ken & Leo, for making me doubt I under-watered, although the summer/winter differences are worth remembering.  This is the first I've heard of it.  I really suspect my problem is lack of attention.  I'm fairly sure the planting medium was dry whenever I watered.  Saying "summer watering on the order of twice a week" is definitely not what I've done.  These aren't cacti and they may be getting too little light, too.  (It's a big east facing window that isn't used constantly.)  For now I'll keep the few that have survived, but have two small pots that I'd love to fill.  Suspect some time I'll give in to the temptation when I see them at the grocery store or nearby greenhouse/plant store.  Hate to be a serial plant killer.

While I still will use a guitar when needed for my storytelling programs, it's not easy with my fretting hand shortened on the pinky finger due to Dupuytren's Contracture.  I had the finger worked on once, but the brace I was supposed to use during recovery was too big & the finger became worse.  Not interested in possibly tempting my luck further with other treatment.  Fortunately the dulcimer is easier even when I do something forming a chord.  I'm told I mainly "finger dance" as I find the noter doesn't quite satisfy my desire to be "hands on."

Dusty, That's a good idea. Thanks. In the flesh, so to speak, is always preferable.

Curtis, I see you are in the San Diego area.  If you haven't already done so, you might consider contacting the Southern California Dulcimer Heritage Society .  They hold a big annual event in the fall, and you might be able to showcase some of your instruments there.  @Leo-Kretzner is a member here and is intimately involved in that group.  He might have some advice for you as well.

If you are going to sell some of them, it's the shipping which will become the biggest chore, and the protective packaging so they don't get crushed in transit, and just getting suitable shipping boxes.

Are you saying you have over 80 dulcimers? You may want to get a well advertised estate sale going and a professional person to help with this. It's a whole lot of dulcimers.

Jim, I have an old John Maxwell dulcimer that was missing a peg when I bought it. I fashioned a new one of maple that looked similar to the original.  His pegs were distinctive.

Exactly what Dan said.  The luthier would have to have your instrument in hand to make a replica peg; it's not something that can be done from a distance.

No there is no off the shelf peg for your dulcimer. Each maker had his own way of making pegs and the pegs were "fitted" to it's own hole. If you can find a local luthier learned in historical dulcimer making, they can "make" you a peg and "fit" it.

I have obtained a John Maxwell dulcimer (1975) three string, which is missing a tuner peg - friction, wooden, with a very large finger hold.  The exterior hole diameter is 11.2 mm, interior size of same hole is 10.34 mm - exterior diameter of hole on the opposite side of the head is 7.6 mm.  Do not seem to be able to find anything resembling the original tuning pegs.  Open to suggestions.  Jim

If you have any truly collectable instruments by known historic makers -- Pritchard, Thomas, Singleton, Presnell, Mize, Ritchie, etc.   Make a list, assign a price, and post them here where other  serious dulcimer collectors can have an opportunity to enlarge their collection!

Or, pick out those "special" instruments, come here and post a list.  Then create a limited time auction post for one instrument at a time....

Make a list of your dulcimer playing friends and acquaintances.  Don't ask them,  Just "assign" one of your instruments to each person, based on whatever criteria you prefer.  Tell them to pick it up or arrange shipment.  

The Kentucky and North Carolina pieces were usually around 28 inch VSL.  (29 inch was common) The Virginia pieces were closer to 26 inch VSL. (Many shorter than that!) With that said, there were pieces in all regions that fell longer and shorter! Basically the Kentucky would have been a few inches longer than the Virginia in VSL...why? I have no idea. VSL is just one variation, the Virginians also pushed the nut farther up the staple board where as the Kentucky kept it agin the tail piece. Very different tonal qualities between the two methods, personal preference I suppose.

After passing my 81st birthday it seems prudent to consider dispersing my dulcimer collection. I have more of them than I do years on this earth - neither situation was planned, they "jes' growed!" I welcome practical suggestions. (I can also be contacted at my email: "Curt" at "last name" dot com.)

Years ago a gentleman from KY taught me how to build a mountain dulcimer. Do not remember how the conversion went but he indicated the VSL and fretboard lay out was based on a KY dulcimer. So I'm wondering if there were regional differences in the VSL. If there were differences was there a large difference? If the VSL from one state to the next was similar I wonder how that occurred.     

Randy is right. I've tried that in the past and it works well.

Thanks Randy.  That may be worth a shot!

Wooden friction pegs get polished slick and hard. Unpolish the pegs and the holes by scratching/roughing with sand paper. Don't sand any wood off! I forget what grit I've used but 80 or 100 may be good to start. If you are industrious and patient  and work with finesse you can refurbish the pegs.

Yes, uke tuners will work.  There are also a variety of geared tuners.  Just make sure, if you use geared tuners, that you install them 'right way around' as they come as "lefts" and "rights".

My wooden pegs have had it.  No amount of goop, drops, etc. is helping.  Need to find geared or friction tuners to fit.  Could I just use ukulele type tuners?  Thanks

Got it.  Thanks, Ken.

I've known several people over the years who have switched from guitar to MD, but usually for wrist pain or arthritis in the major fretting fingers, not the pinky.    IMHO it's good to get switched over now, before other hand issues start to appear.  

Noter & Drone is certainly the most definitive switch from the multi-finger/string fretting of guitar.  It has its own unique sound to offer, and a whole new world for you to explore.  One thing I would suggest is to not use the pathetic 1/4" dowel which even companies like McSpadden and Folkcraft include with their instruments.  Instead, look for noters of approximately the same diameter as your index finger.  I make many noters by rounding and polishing the "pen blanks" of exotic woods you can get from the Internet.  Bamboo also makes exemplary noters.  

Here's a link to a booklet I wrote a number of years back for folks interested in Noter & Drone style.  You can also find it in the Noter & Drone Group here (you have to "Join" a Group to be able to interact in any of the discussions).

If you have any questions, don't hesitate to ask here or in a Private Message.

Ken Hulme's "Get Noterized!" Article - Strumelia | fotmd.com

I'm starting to develop pain in my left hand pinky from guitar playing.  I have a mountain dulcimer that I've started playing in noter style.  Has anyone else actually made a complete switch to mountain dulcimer from guitar for this reason?

Thanks

I move them up against the house in the winter months. Otherwise, all over the place!! 

Btw, despite the thread name, almost all my succulents, esp cacti, are outside. 

We're at ~3500 in SoCal, and I move them up close to the house, then cover them up with tarp/drop cloth on the handful of nights that we have freezing. A few I bring inside during the coldest weeks.

If your locale has a lot of December rains, better to bring them in or put under awnings, etc, so they don't get winter over-watering that way. Wet soil and temps in the 30's or lower - bad combo! Learned that the hard way when a few died like that.

Mostly though, they're easy - more tolerant of little watering than of over-watering.