WoW we have already topped 50 members
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80 and still growing..... Strumelia, think you picked a winner idea. thanks again for all your work in setting this up..... CHEER, CHEER, CHEER....
Forum Activity for @rod-westerfield
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80 and still growing..... Strumelia, think you picked a winner idea. thanks again for all your work in setting this up..... CHEER, CHEER, CHEER....
WoW we have already topped 50 members
OFF TOPIC discussions
We are now almost to 75. Growing fast and becoming Good Neighbors (sounding like an Insurance comercial)!
WoW we have already topped 50 members
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Yeah to growth...and big thank ya to Strumelia for starting this... three cheers...
WoW we have already topped 50 members
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I'm pretty amazed myself as to how quickly it is growing. I am so pleased that it seems so easy to make friends here and get to know each other better. People who were just names to me before are now suddenly more like friends. I really love that. And new people from all over are appearing- people with many varied mountain dulcimer musical tastes and styles, even from various countries. I also am sensing that this site makes it very easy for beginners to feel comfortable- YAY!Thank you and everyone here SO MUCH for making it a success! :D
WoW we have already topped 50 members
OFF TOPIC discussions
This site is growing daily. It is nice to be part of a new adventure and one connected to the Mountain Dulcimer. I am having fun here and enjoy the ease in which to do certain things such as add photos or add friends. Agains kudos for starting this forum
updated by @dennis-waldrop: 01/13/19 05:09:18PM
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I agree! I love all good music regardless of the convention. Ed Buhler said:
I love all styles on the dulcimer. I love the drone styles - I love the flat picking fast tunes (John Henry), but I also do a lot of finger picking too. Some BEAUTIFUL songs can be played using a finger picking style. Music is music - that's why there are so many styles - you don't worry about what others say - you play what is in your heart and what sounds good to you. That's my take anyway.
I am going to add an MP 3 here for you of me finger picking a song I wrote - I think it sounds fine. I love to play the dulcimer - and while there is a soft spot in my heart for Jean Ritchie and her drone style - I can sit and listen to Bing Futch crank out some jazzy tune at the same time. I love them all.
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I think it's sort of to each his or her own. Personally, I play melody/drone or finger dancing on the melody string and let the drones do their thing. However, my preference in music is fairly traditional or traditionally styled music with a strong emphasis on Scottish, and Irish music where the drones are perfect for the music. For other music, I agree that a noter/drone might not be the best way to convey the music. If you're going to be playing modern music with it's tendency to have accidentals thrown in all over the place, a strictly diatonic dulcimer might not even be the best for you, or at least a strict modal tuning might not due as well as say a 1-3-5. You might need to have additional frets or even a fully chromatic fretboard, but always remember that the dulcimer you play is your instrument, played in your lap, and in your style or styles as needed. It's your opinion on how you play that is important. If you enjoy the sound of the music you are making, it's right, but if you don't then it's not and a change might be needed.I learned the hard way that I needed to decide and play for myself by feeling really put down as a noter and melody/drone player when I went to my first workshop ever. The group was told by the instructor that the noter style would bore the audience and that chords were the only way to play for a full rich sound. I walked away from that workshop feeling about 2 inches tall and resolved to learn chords. After practicing with chords my arthritis doctor told me to give it up because of the increased pain I was having in my hands. Since I really wasn't enjoying playing chords as they didn't sound right to me and I was suffering intense pain I gave up chords completely As I'd originally fallen in love with the sound of the dulcimer played in a traditional manner, I was quite pleased to be able to say to anyone who said that I just had to learn to chord to progress, that I had a note from my doctor saying that chording was hazardous to my hand health. ;-) LOL
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Well, my 2 cents is that the dulcimer can be as easy or as hard as anyone wants it to be. The world is so big that there is room for any style of playing that anyone wants to do. A lot of people think the kind of stuff I do is hard, others think it's easy. I just play it because I like the music...
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Did you ever play "Pretty Belinda" ? Tun your Dulcimer to EAG. It beginns at the 3rd fret. It's realy great!Wilfried
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
<........their is No wrong way to play the mt. dulcimer!....>BINGO!!!!
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
A baritone would be a great solo accompaniment instrument if you have a reasonably low voice and played drone chords or finger chords but not the full melody.
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Ken Hulme said:
Yes that is exactly right. I have a baritone tuned AEa, and I wanted it expressly to accompany singing of slow ballads and more bluesy songs; it is too big in terms of hand stretch for doing fast tunes and whilst I do the odd bit of instrumental in a song, the playing of melody is not its primary purpose.Cynthia;
Tuning:
You can tune any dulcimer, with the same normal set of strings, to DAA, DAd, CGG or CGc; maybe has high as FCC/FCf and as low as BFF/BFb. The strings are certainly flexible enough to go up and down at least one note
I don't recommend a baritone instrument for beginners because the normal baritone tuning does not allow you to play melody together with others. The tuning - AEa - uses ordinary DAd tabulature, but you're not tuned to the same key - you're in A, not D - so it doesn't sound very good if you play along with other dulcimers tuned to D. You can play guitar-style accompaniment chords along with D tuned dulcimers, but that's not the conventional dulcimer unison melody playing experience... A baritone/bass dulcimer is like a stand-up bass in a string band. It plays rhythmic "filler sound" not melodies. The dulcimer is/was originally designed as a personal melody playing instrument, not an orchestral part-playing instrument.
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Cynthia;Tuning:You can tune any dulcimer, with the same normal set of strings, to DAA, DAd, CGG or CGc; maybe has high as FCC/FCf and as low as BFF/BFb. The strings are certainly flexible enough to go up and down at least one noteI don't recommend a baritone instrument for beginners because the normal baritone tuning does not allow you to play melody together with others. The tuning - AEa - uses ordinary DAd tabulature, but you're not tuned to the same key - you're in A, not D - so it doesn't sound very good if you play along with other dulcimers tuned to D. You can play guitar-style accompaniment chords along with D tuned dulcimers, but that's not the conventional dulcimer unison melody playing experience... A baritone/bass dulcimer is like a stand-up bass in a string band. It plays rhythmic "filler sound" not melodies. The dulcimer is/was originally designed as a personal melody playing instrument, not an orchestral part-playing instrument.
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
That's what I want to do!!!!! Sally Pena said:
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I recognized Stephen Seifert's playing as soon as I heard it, before I looked at the page!~ He was my first teacher! Sally Pena said:
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
There are many players who are better noter-and-drone players than I am. That said, it's always a challenge for me to note a fiddle tune at anything approaching fiddle tune speed, playing cleanly, and throwing in variations. I'm a slow learner and it takes me awhile to know a fiddle tune that well.Robin
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I think it's great that people play in noter style because it may not be as easy as it looks!!Noter style, fingerpicking, flatpicking, strumming etc. are just techniques and each has it's place in the wonderful variety of music that's played on the dulcimer.From my own perspective concentrating on one technique only would be too limiting but I do for the most part fingerpick.Nick
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Here's another one, bowed dulcimer, this time: Cynthia said:
Wow, thanks for all your help everyone! very cool...
I can't identify any sound files made with their instruments... or if you can think of someone Guy may not have mentioned please let me know
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
here's one that I thought was amazing when I started... note that he's using a capo: Also, you can go to Jerry Rockwell's website and learn bunches. Just Google Jerry Rockwell dulcimer. Cynthia said:
I can't identify any sound files made with their instruments... or if you can think of someone Guy may not have mentioned please let me know
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
So many good builders out there. Each one has their own particular magic they work....I love McSpadden, Folk Craft (both their own brand and the Folkroots brand) for the "mass market" dulcimer. You can't go wrong with them.For lower to mid range luthiers, there are so many great builders. One in particular who does a great job on the lower priced starter dulcimer is David Lynch at Sweet Woods. He also does very fine work with the mid range priced "professional" models.For the mid-range price, there are very good builders also... A few of my favorites are David McKinney at Modern Mountain Dulcimer, Jerry Rockwell, Ron Ewing, Tom Yocky, Tom Fellenbaum, John Stockard, and Keith Young (not an exhaustive list, mind you... just a few that I have played and love).Then you get into your higher ticket dulcimers.... my particular favorite in that range is Dale Foye of Aeolus Instruments. His dulcimers price at about $2,000. They are sheer heaven to listen to and play. He is making one for me right now that is all Rosewood with Spruce sound board. I'm chomping at the bit for him to finish it for me!!!There are so many good luthiers out there. I would definitely recommend that you speak to your luthier over the phone and be very clear with each other what you want.... Carson Turner said:
If you don't mind, and done such that we avoid any potentially actionable comments, might you list maybe the top of the "wow, you have a xxxx" and the bottom of the "hope you didn't pay much for that xxxx maker"Of course understanding that there are tons and tons of makers in the "Some Guy in Texas" category (I own a couple of those) that may be outstanding or may not. I think many of us newbies are looking at instruments from quantity builders and not "Bob's garage".[SNIP]
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Well said Ken... I think you explained that well...... Wow Carson that's a question and half...hmmm have ta think on that one...I think is interesting to me that the dulcimer is able to play what music a person wants... I too have been playing for over 30 yrs... started out in CGG use a noter.... then went to play with my fingers, and even adding a few chords over the last year really... and yet the other day I set up a dulcimer with all .010 strings and even used a noter..( P.S. don't tell anyone..lol) and even record a couple of them and posted them..am I switching back to a noter.. probably not. But I think it is good we can try or play all skills or ways of playing the dulcimer... who's know which style you'll settle with... plus as a teacher my students may want to learn one way and not the other..So expand your horizons... try playing different ways....and make a luthier happy by a dulcimer for the different set ups.... cause your going to catch DAD (Dulcimer Acquisition Disease) anyway....
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I'd have to agree with Ken and Carson, here, Cynthia; with the additional remark that there are three different instruments called "dulcimer", and while the bowed and the mountain dulcimers are related, the hammered dulcimer is really quite different.All the different soundbox shapes of mountain dulcimer just sort of evolved from the original zitters that drifted south from the German settlements in Pennsylvania, as local woodworkers experimented with hardwoods and fret placement and numbers of strings to produce an inexpensive instrument for everything from church hymn singing to dances. You'll even see what some people call the "Tennessee music box" style from the Tennessee Valley area, with the tuning pegs on the player's right instead of on the left. Ours is really a "folk" instrument with nothing standard about it and no single inventor or virtuoso maker - we have not yet seen, I don't think, an Antonio Stradivari of the MD.As for picking one out for yourself: Make sure you can handle the instrument before you buy, if at all possible. Look to make sure the fretboard is straight, not bent or bowed.Try the strings, making sure that the note on the 7 fret is right on an octave above the open string. Strum it and see whether or not you like the tone. Traditionally it isn't supposed to sound big and mellow like a guitar, but high and silvery; your mileage may vary. Depending on the speed of your Internet connection, look for Bing Futch and other dulcimer players on Youtube and you will get some idea what a well-tuned instrument can sound like ... for a real surprise, look for "pinball dulcimers" there!
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Cynthia;Unfortunately if you try to listen to everyone a dulcimer does sound something like:'hourglass/teardrop/aorell body; 3/4/6/8/12 strings; doubled/equadistant; with added frets 1+ 6+ 8+ or all (chromatic); baritone/octave/-ette/bass/standard; tuned to play mode DAd DAD CGc CGC AEA DF#A DADD etc etc' and 'may be cappo'd to play....' and 'can tune CGc and play DAd on it'...and....and ..... there is the - 'great for playing fiddle tunes, mandolin tunes, etc etc'and .... 'may be bowed' .....gasp for air....Truth of the matter is, for a simple instrument it does come in a huge variety of shapes, sizes and configurations. Probably because it is more or less the last of the Western folk instruments to be of interest to a modern audience, and as a result is undergoing a wave of changes by people trying to make it fit into modern music which it was never intended to play.Hmmm... Dulcimer Classification... some thoughts.ShapeEverything under the sun! However the good news that that shape is more than 99% cosmetic . Being hourglass or elliptical or rectangular, by itself, it does not effect the sound. Pick the shape that most appeals to you.MaterialsDulcimers have been made from most imaginable woods and plywoods, lexan plastic, paper, carbon fiber, even Leggo blocks! Cardboard dulcimers are a good inexpensive introductory instrument. So are plywood or veneer dulcimers. Solid wood dulcimers are the most common and serious. Plastic instruments are mostly still novelties.Number of Strings3, 4 and 6 string dulcimers are most common. Essentially most dulcimers have 3 courses of strings - bass, middle drone, and melody. Often the melody course is doubled; sometimes the bass and melody courses are doubled; or all three course are doubled. The real odd arrangement is 4 equidistant strings a specialist setup, not for everyone.TonalityOctave Dulcimer or Dulcimette - physically much small in overall size, and normally tuned an octave higher than a standard dulcimer.Standard Dulcimer - normally tuned to the keys of C and D. Most useful for individual playing or playing with other dulcimers in unison.Barintone and Bass Dulcimers - physically about the same size as a standard dulcimer, but tuned to much lower ranges.Octave, Baritone and Bass dulcimers are essentially special purpose instruments that can be played as solo instruments or with standard dulcimers where music has been written for their parts. Not instruments particularly good for beginners. Bowed dulcimers are very special purpose instruments, although almost any dulcimer can occaionally be played with a bow.Tunings/KeysThere are eight traditional Modal tunings, and a number of other common ones. Because the dulcimer is not normally chromatic it must be re-tuned to play in different keys.The standard dulcimer is most often tuned to the key of D in the Major or Ionian Modal tuning called DAA; or the equally popular Mixolydian Modal tuning call DAd. Both tunings are equally valid, and dulcimers tuned to each can be played together. Most of us recommend beginners pick either DAA or DAd and spend a few months learning to play several songs and becoming familiar with the instrument using one tuning.Methods of PlayingTraditional - the melody of the song is played on the melody strings, allowing the middle and bass strings to drone accompaniment.Modern - the melody of the song is played by creating chords across all three course, for each note of the melody.AccessoriesCapo or Reverse Capo - these are devices for changing the pitch of some or all of the strings as an alternative to re-tuningStriker - a chopstick-like device occasionally used as an alternative to a pick.Picking A First InstrumentDepending on your budget, I think most of us would recommend that you start with either a cardboard dulcimer, or one of several "student" instruments in the $100 - $200 range from well-known builders. Ask us, we'll tell you who we think of as good builders. Avoid the Applecreek, First Act and other inexpensive instruments made in foreign countries by people who don't know or care.Hope this helps you narrow down your choices somewhat. BTW, ask the folks around here; they'll tell you've I've been messing about with dulciemrs for over 30 years, so I do have an experience and knowledge base from which I speak.
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Cynthia, sometimes too much information is too much. Good luck in choosing your dulcimer! Cynthia said:
Now I'll go back to trying to figure out how the heck I'm going to pick one and get started on the playing part...Cynthia
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
ok now you're scaring me! =8-o Ken Hulme said:
Razyn - I'm thinking about getting the Model 3 - with the wine corkscrew and fretsaw attachments!
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Razyn - I'm thinking about getting the Model 3 - with the wine corkscrew and fretsaw attachments!
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
That's just the regular Swiss Army noter, I think.Dick
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Foggers said:
Or how about having an interchangeable fitting on your index finger - so you can attach the noter when you need it, a soup spoon for the kitchen....a screwdriver for the work shop?? The applications could be endless!!
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
barbara kelly said:
Or how about having an interchangeable fitting on your index finger - so you can attach the noter when you need it, a soup spoon for the kitchen....a screwdriver for the work shop?? The applications could be endless!!Um Ken? Please don't, I would think that would hurt..lol Or, make it long enough to stir soup and you've solved two problems..lol
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Everybody pretty much knows where I stand on traditional playing style , Actually I'm thinking of having an ebony noter implanted on the end on my left index finger - the best of both worlds!!!!!As far as playing style affecting or being affected by the music, I certainly understand that. There are a couple of tunes that I Fingerdance because they sound best that way - All Through The Night, the Welsh lullaby being one.The dulcimer was invented, if you will, expressly to play the transplanted folk songs and broadsides and ballads of England, Scotland, Ireland, Wales, Germany, etc. that becam the music of the Appalachians. Music which came from a dronal, diatonic, simple melody background. It was never created with the thought of playing Reggae or classical Euro, Blues, Jazz, Pop, Rock or anything much later than 19th and early 20th century "music of the people". That it can play all those other kinds of music without significant modification is simply amazing.I prefer to play that older music, because I happen to like it. So I have hundreds of tunes in my repertoire, but only a few that fit in with the contemporary Jam Session. Which is why I'm not fond of jam sessions, I suppose - if you don't 'play well with others' no one is really happy. I'm more than content to play the music I know and love. I'll sit in the corner, doin' my thing, and if someone wants to come over and see what I'm up to they're welcome. I agree that the social aspects of playing dulcimer are nice, but that's not why I play. I play to express myself, to myself.
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Hi- another member pointed out that this discussion is just as much about traditional noter style playing as it is about modern chord style playing.It's a great discussion, and is of interest to all of us no matter what style of playing we prefer- so I moved it to the general dulcimer playing forum so everyone could enjoy it more easily.Carry on! :)
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I like all of them... I'm sure that's why I am starting to acquire quite a brood of dulcimers. LOL I find however that the wood doesn't always really play as big of a part in the sound characteristics of an instrument as does the actual design and manner in which it is built. Obviously wood choices do make a difference though. Clare Chu said:
Fascinating discussion. I find that I'm drawn to the more trebly brighter sounds of the traditional dulcimers, a more plaintive sound that makes me picture a lonely mountain cabin next to a creek. But then again, I'm a violin player and sometime mandolin player so I tend to like trebly sounds.
I noticed that other folks like the walnut with western red cedar topped dulcimers that are mellower sounding and emphasize the bass string more. This seems to be more prevalent in California, maybe because of the guitar background?
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Awesome!!! I'll bet you have a wonderful garden~~~~~~~~:<) Strumelia said:
Rod Westerfield said:I've got about 4000 worms right in my kitchen! Wait, I'll go get them!I'm not sure that a fishing pole left, but I'll borrow one an let's go fishin.... love them worms...
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Clare Chu said:
Clare I totally agree with you on this. And yes I *do* think the guitar strength of the West coast had an influence on mtn dulcimer revival in the 1960-70's.I too am into fiddle and mandolin and I too prefer the higher plaintive treble sound on the dulcimer. I don't even use heavier middle or bass strings at all, in fact.This is all SO interesting!Fascinating discussion. I find that I'm drawn to the more trebly brighter sounds of the traditional dulcimers, a more plaintive sound that makes me picture a lonely mountain cabin next to a creek. But then again, I'm a violin player and sometime mandolin player so I tend to like trebly sounds.
I noticed that other folks like the walnut with western red cedar topped dulcimers that are mellower sounding and emphasize the bass string more. This seems to be more prevalent in California, maybe because of the guitar background?
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
A lot of my BG lovin' friends have a surprisingly open mind... Some of the Celtic tunes can be quite lively. You can really hear how American folk music came from a Celtic background. Some of the melodies are almost identical. The style is a bit different...
Dulcimer or Guitar?
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I'm just getting acquainted to Celtic and Renaissance music. Although I love playing and listening to it, I wonder how it will go over here in my area. I'll give it a try but, they'll probably go to sleep. They're accustomed to listening almost exclusively to BG.