Non-Metal Fret Material
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Nate, I believe Randy has built, at least, an instrument or two with wooden frets.
Forum Activity for @robin-thompson
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Non-Metal Fret Material
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Hello all, I am wondering if there is information on differences in tone between metal frets vs alternative materials and if there is any precedent for trading off the durability of metal frets for different tonal characteristics? I built 2 dulcimers using 80 lb test fishing line tied on as frets and both had a very soft tone. I am not sure if this is due to the very soft woods I used for them or if the fretwire played a major role.
I've noticed in fretless dulcimer videos by Randy Adams the tone seems to be softer than fretted ones, but this also may be due to other factors of construction.
I have also seen cigar box ukuleles with wooden toothpicks for frets but, again, I do not know if the soft tone was instead due to other aspects of the construction or the nylon strings.
I am aware that very hard woods or bone are the preferred material for nut and bridge, and have read that metal frets offer better projection than the gut frets of historical instruments.
The reason this came to mind is I built a dulcimer with a 0 fret but without noticing used a lower fretwire than the rest of the frets. I was about to pull it and replace it, but out of curiosity I folded up a piece of paper and placed it on top of the 0 fret under the strings and to my ear it sounded much more pleasant.
The difference between the folded paper and the first fret was that the 0 fret was noticeably softer, like a more subtle version of the difference between using a fingertip vs a pick. Since the strings dont bend or rub very much on the 0 fret I am planning to just leave it this way and see how long it lasts, however if i tried the same on any other frets it would most likely wear through very quickly.
This all makes me very curious about the idea of wooden frets, tied on gut or mono-filament frets, maybe even paper topped frets where some type of stiff paper is frequently replaced. It seems like the important thing would be making sure that the fret material can be easily replaced when it wears through.
Would love to hear some thoughts on this! Hope everyone is well
Blue Lion Dulcimers why so Special?
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
star2fire:
me too!
Thank you to all the beautiful people who have post kind welcome messages. I have been trying to answer with a comment but I’m struggling to figure out how to use this site. I guess it’s gonna take me awhile to figure out how this works.
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I'm just delighted Robin refers to a dulcimer as "tool." That makes it so much easier to justify buying another one. I must have a dozen hammers in my garage, so I should have at least that many dulcimers.
Don Pedi is an American treasure, that's for sure. He both collects and plays the old music. He's like the Seegers and the Lomaxes all rolled into one.
In the 2012 picture to which Strumelia links, he is holding a Modern Mountain Dulcimer, which he seems to have been using for his main dulcimer for several years now. It does indeed have both a 1+ and a 6+ fret. Most of the still photos he uses for media stuff show trad dulcimers with friction tuners and no extra frets, but he makes practical use of modern innovations like geared tuners and extra frets.
What impresses me consistently in Don's playing is not the speed of his fingering-as impressive as it is--but his rhythmic strumming. He never relies on a rote pattern but keeps tunes moving in a danceable and yet varied rhythm.
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Don plays so many wonderful old tunes, some of which he collected himself from people who have passed from this life. How I would describe what Don does is he plays traditional tunes in an innovative style which conveys both the tunes and the spirit of the tunes as he collected them. He uses the mountain dulcimer as a tool; like with any job, you want to use the tool which best fits the job. Don is a treasure!
How is the COVID-19 coronavirus affecting you?
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Great idea about mailing and then sharing the cup of tea together, Cynthia! Like a little tea club.
There will be some roof raking going on here today as well.
We too 'embrace the hyggelig'. I draped strings of various little lights like a canopy over our little kitchen table where we eat... feels like eating under the stars, but of many colors... sooo cozy we decided we'll be leaving them up for the coming months. We always line up several candles on the table as well when we eat meals.
Jan you're right I forgot about the organizing/purging pandemic fad. I did some of that too and successfully sold off a substantial bunch of stuff on ebay. Didn't purge as many things as I was hoping to, but I did make a nice chunk of change while I was enthused. :)
In terms of cleaning/organizing projects- Last month I went through every bed pillow in the house (16 of them!) and threw out 6 of the oldest ones and bought 2 new ones. Some of those 'heirloom' feather pillows were decades old. (yuk) I also tossed the old inner zipper pillow protectors and bought new ones for every pillow. (got a couple 8-packs of cotton zipper pillow protectors on am*z*n.) Nice to have that fresh pillow feeling!
We also decided to get rid of the 30 yr old high quality LLBean real down comforter on our bed- it just didn't seem to fluff up much anymore and I suspected the feathers inside were slowly breaking down over time. It was time. I took a chance on ordering a down-substitute duvet insert this time instead of real down (which is SO expensive now anyway). Also got new duvet zipper covers for it. It was so lightweight that we had doubts, but the first few nights I was so overheated i kept asking Brian to turn the night thermostat lower. This duvet is way warmer than our ancient real down one, and we wound up reducing the heat at night by 4 degrees... which will save money.
We spend so much time at home waiting out the covid blues. Doing things that give us a sense of positivity, connection, and renewal is helpful. :)
How is the COVID-19 coronavirus affecting you?
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Roof raking at zero degrees has become an exciting and uplifting event during covid. Even thought about visited a neighbor who moved away a year ago and recently returned. What was he thinking anyway? This is the perfect place to live! And I discovered many new herb teas that are healthful, refreshing, give give me something to break up the day and mail to friends to have a cup of tea together over the phone. Then folks have something to look forward to. Oh, and more Duolingo languages - I actually got through the new Finnish course 4 times, and all the Scandinavian languages as well. Think Danish hyggelig,,,
VSL, Tuning and Breaking Strings
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
@ Strumelia Thanks for the reply. You are right about the just intonation dulcimers. I can translate the notation you used to put in to the string calculator since it includes octave numbers. It is helpful to learn that I should lean towards the heavier side for tuning between C & D and G & A. Thanks for not giving up on me. Ken
VSL, Tuning and Breaking Strings
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Dusty Turtle:
@Traildad, you are making a false assumption that a note using an upper case letter always refers to a note below middle C. I tune my baritone dulcimer GDg. All of those notes are below middle C. I use the lower case g to indicate that the string is an octave above the bass string. I also have an octave baritone dulcimer, meaning it is tuned an octave above that baritone, and I still indicate the tuning as GDg even though only the low G is below middle C and the D and high g are above it. I also have octave dulcimers that I often tune DAd, but all those notes are above middle C.
In other words, the use of the upper and lower case letters shows how the notes relate to each other, not how they relate to some objective standard like a piano.
There are ways to indicate exactly which octave on the piano a given tone is from, but almost none of us bother with that.
Strumelia's blog was not specifically about string gauge, but she does mention that she stopped using a wound bass string and only used string gauges around .10 or .11. The blog post is about how she gets to the main 4 keys of C, D, G, and A with two dulcimers, one that can tune to C and D and one that can tune to G and A.
If all you want to know is what octaves one uses for 1-5-5 tunings in those four keys . . .
C-G-G would usually be C3-G3-G3
D-A-A would usually be D3-A3-A3
G-D-D would be either G2-D3-D3 (as a baritone) or G3-D4-D4 (as a 3/4-size instrument like a Ginger)
A-E-E would be either A2-E3-E3 (as a baritone) or A3-E4-E4 (as a 3/4-size instrument)
Of all those notes, only the D4 and E4 are above middle C.
@ Dusty Turtle Thanks for the reply. I don’t mean to make assumptions. I was using the notation that is used on the string calculator to differentiate between octaves. The notation you are using above works as well since it indicates octaves and I can convert it for the string gauge calculator. Thanks for your patience and help. Ken
How is the COVID-19 coronavirus affecting you?
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Pandemic fads: searching, sorting, cleaning and purging, all while trying to locate things that I know are around here somewhere...
Bridge feet contact area
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Could you post some pictures.
Bridge feet contact area
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
I have completed a "what if" all poplar hourglass instrument, 26.5 VSL and the fretboard "floats" it is only in contact with the top at the peghead and tail block, otherwise about 3/16" clearance full length. The bridge rests directly on the top with no contact with fretboard. Right now the bridge feet each have about 1/2" x 5/8" bearing on the top. A previous trial build has fretboard attached but stops short of the tail block. It is walnut with butternut top. The two builds have very similar volume and tone. I was thinking of decreasing the footprint of the bridge on the top to see if it changes anything. Both instruments have bracing under the bridge area. I am going to go to a size heavier strings also on the poplar instrument. Does anyone have any thoughts on this?
'
How is the COVID-19 coronavirus affecting you?
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A word concerning reactions to vaccines: They are annoying but actually a sign, that the vaccines is working. The reactions are a reaction of our immune system, so they mean that the vaccines managed to provoke the immune system to do something about the potential threat. Ergo: Building anti-bodys. So they shouldn't be anything to worry about. And quite tame in relation to the real virus/sickness. No reaction doesn't mean however, that the vaccine is not working. Probably your immune system was quite good at the start, but will profit from the shot non the less.
Strumelia:
What pandemic fads have you guys tried out this past weird year? Have i forgotten some of the hobbies and trends that have been popular during this endless pandemic?
As I wrote here multiple times starting to play guitar again and starting to play dulcimer the first time at all :)
And it seems I'm not alone in this regard. The owner of the local instrument store told me after the first lockdown that he got a lot of new customers as a result of the lockdown.
I guess people missed live music and decided to do it on their own.
Sadly not enough to compensate his losses from the first and later lockdowns but it's a start at least.
updated by @jost: 02/09/21 03:58:07PM
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I also find it interesting that in the old video he has a 6.5, an 8.5, and a 13.5 fret... but not the 1.5 fret which is the lower mate to the 8.5. Then in the 2012 photo you can see he's included the 1.5. I too have both the 1.5 and the 6.5 (and their matching octave higher mates) on my dulcimers that i used a lot for oldtime jamming. There are many accidental notes in oldtime tunes, notes that pop up but don't necessarily change the mode or the key, so those extra frets come in handy for that kind of fast oldtime jamming. If playing simple tunes at home I might opt for a purely diatonic dulcimer and retuning more to match modes as I like. In festival jams you have little control of what everyone's doing and you have to be able to get into a key and mode fast or else drop out... so I find the extra frets solve that problem neatly.
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Ok, so it looks and sounds as though he's tuned (from bass to melody) Aee. His tonic note A in on the third fret, which means in this case he is definitely playing in ionian mode. His bass string is not very heavy, but still looks heavier than the melody string, which is in keeping with his tuning it to the same A note as most DAd players use for their middle string. So, he likely had a string gauge for his bass string which was similar to the middle string of DAA or DAd players. Then, I'm thinking he had thin gauge (.010) for both his middle and melody strings, the enable him to tune them both up to high e. I imagine he had a dulcimer for playing in the keys of A and G (Aee and Gdd), and another dulcimer for playing in the keys of D and C. That's what i typically do in oldtime jams myself.
I notice he has wooden tuning pegs on this dulcimer but had installed some of those cheap freestanding in-line fine tuners to get perfectly in tune. I tried those out once but found they tend to wobble all over and also ate into the strings, making them break more often. I am guessing he's moved more to geared tuners since this 1994 video, especially for festival jamming. Here's a photo of a dulcimer he used in 2012 for a house concert jam, showing geared tuners.
updated by @strumelia: 02/09/21 11:47:39AM
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
Glad you're home, Ken. Home is sometimes the best medicine. Nina
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I'll try to figure the tuning later, but they're playing in the key of A in this session. (Brian tells me the fiddler is Ross Mohn.)
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
Ken I'm so grateful to hear that you are home and recovering. You were missed here and, I know, got many dulcimer prayers...and a few more from the ukulele players. I read your note on here as it gently snows in Vermont.
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Amazing. Any idea what tuning he is using on his dulcimer.
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Dave Goldberg on banjo (with his head down most of the time), our good friend Deb Tankard on bass (she lives in Woodstock). Linda Baker on guitar in purple shirt (r.i.p. Linda). I'm not sure who the main fiddler is.
How is the COVID-19 coronavirus affecting you?
OFF TOPIC discussions
So the pandemic is now going on 1 year, and folks will be hanging close to home/social distancing for a while to come yet.
Let's see... what pandemic fads have we all gone through, while trying to do something that feels comforting or productive?
First there was the baking craze... lots of sourdough and other breads! Me, i was baking apple crumb muffins and choc chip cookies a whole lot. Then i also started making yogurt since we love yogurt at home. Both those things I'm still enjoying doing.
Some people started knitting, or sewing masks. I used to knit a lot but did not take it back up during quarantine. I did however sew a couple dozen masks for us and our grown children. I sewed a new batch of masks a month ago to freshen our home supply.
Some people adopted dogs or other pets bring them cheer. 
There was a lot of fitness walking during the warm months, and also people roller skating, and buying regular or indoor Peloton bikes, elipticals, mini trampolines, doing yoga online. I got a little trampoline, my husband got a trainer to put his bike on- to ride in the livingroom. I sold my two old pairs of roller skates and roller gear on ebay for a good price! :)
People got into gardening with a passion this year. I did my usual vegetable garden, but that's not new for me.
Now people have been diving into collecting houseplants in a big way. I think it's a way of bringing the promise of Spring and new change and growth to alleviate this dark pandemic winter. Plants in the house are a tonic and a comfort! I've always had about a dozen nice cactus and succulents in various windows of our house. Years ago i opted for cactus because I knew our cats would leave them alone. heheh. One of my older cacti died last month after many years.
In the Fall I got a new snake plant for my office, which has been doing well and brings me joy. But today while buying some groceries at our local farm store, I really succumbed to temptation and bought two large new houseplants- a dark burgundy leaved rubber tree plant, and one of those trendy Monstera Deliciosa- those big green jungle-y plants with the splits and holes in their leaves. Luckily I had a couple of locations for them next to windows where they might do well. So nice to have green living things in the house during the dead of winter!
What pandemic fads have you guys tried out this past weird year? Have i forgotten some of the hobbies and trends that have been popular during this endless pandemic?
Need Help Identifying two dulcimers if possible.
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Dulcimer #1. Butternut top, walnut sides and back. Engraving on head scroll and neck.
Dulcimer #2 Solid Walnut, thick waist, Heavy build. Weight is well above 3 pounds. Nickel silver bridge and nut.
thanks.
a 1994 Mt Airy jam with Don Pedi
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Don's playing is always stellar, and this clip is no exception. Thanks for sharing this, Robin.
And for those players out there who fret with their thumbs, note the angle with which Don holds the dulcimer on his lap. The strumming end is tight against his body, but the fretting end sticks way out over his knee. The instrument is not parallel on his lap. He needs that angle to be able to fret comfortably, especially up the fretboard. You can see that angle best during the first 1:20 of the video.
Introduce Yourself!
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Awwww, we'd only get into a fight about Synods or closed versus open communion. This way we infiltrate all the groups. 
Introduce Yourself!
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Hmmm. At the risk of becoming sectarian, maybe we need a group of " 'Luterans' Beyond the Lute" 
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
Glad to have you back, Ken, but here's a thought. Whatever you were watching when your heartbeat returned to normal needs to become a method to calm down your heart when it races. Do you have some way to monitor your heartbeat?
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
So good to hear from you, Ken L-- I admit, I was concerned by what felt like a long absence. I pray for continued healing for you.
New player / New purchase / Wellborn dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I'm new to fotmd, but I discovered this forum thread when I was googling Fred Wellborn, Sr. to see if I could learn more about my dulcimer. Let me tell you what I know.
I purchased mine as a Western Carolina University student from Balsam Dulcimer Gallery in Waynesville, NC in 1996. I was told that Mr. Wellborn made dulcimers that supplied several music stores in the Blue Ridge area. Sadly, he died of a cardiac event while delivering some instruments to a store in or around Asheville in 1997.
I have enjoyed my curly maple dulcimer all these years. It was well-made. My only regret was that he used cheap plastic tuning pegs. One day I intend to replace them. I know this is an old thread, but hope you're enjoying your instrument--you had a good find.
All the best, Todd
John Frazier dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Hello,
I came a across a beautiful hour glass dulcimer made in 1976. I was wondering if anyone is familiar with John Frazier dulcimers made in South Bend Indiana.
I'm finding almost no info on them or possible value. I have found that he was active around 1970 on, built only around 20 a years during the dulcimer boom. (See photo)
Thank you for your help.
Kevin
updated by @kevin63: 02/08/21 02:11:44AM
Introduce Yourself!
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Hi Ken, good to meet you, Brother. Thanks, I will.
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
Great news, Ken! So glad your heart is healing and you're able to return home.
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
Thanks for the welcome back. I had thought of taking my MacBookPro with me, but decided not to do so. I tried to use my iPhone, but frankly the text was too small even after enlarging a little and I had a difficult time concentrating anyway.
Gradually I will be back in to the swing of things. There is still a lot of healing to do.
Ken
"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."
updated by @ken-longfield: 02/07/21 09:05:58PM
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
Ken, it's good to see you back here! Thankful things are going well for you. You've been in my thoughts and prayers.
The Positive Thread...
OFF TOPIC discussions
So glad to hear from you, Ken. You just need to tell the docs that it's not "an irregular beat." You're a musician; it's called "syncopation."
updated by @dusty: 02/07/21 08:30:44PM
The Positive Thread...
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Ken, so happy to see your post and know you are 'fixed' and back home again for recovery. We missed you and we worried! 
Yaaaaay Ken is back. 