Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Well Nate that was long ago, (like 50 years ago)........things were different back then.............just keep on and it will quit sooner or later.
Forum Activity for @salt-springs
OFF TOPIC discussions
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
WOW, that's all really terrible to hear. Really glad to hear that you persevered and kept a good spirit. Internet trolls definitely pale in comparison to the kind of real hate that exists out there. If weird comments that have nothing to do with me are the worst it gets, I think I'm getting off pretty lucky as far as internet hate goes.
Play Music On The Porch Day 2019
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
@robert-schuler I'm glad you found time for playing Kesh Jig on the porch!
Play Music On The Porch Day 2019
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Hope you all had a good porch picking. Although I spent most of the day corn picking I did find time for a tune on my porch. Each year I choose a tune to mark the day, this year it's Kesh Jig. It's a very simple tune that's fun to play...Robert
RIP Happy Traum
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I got to know the Traums from SingOut magazine. I just dug out 1972 volume 21 no3. If you have that issue there is a great interview of the Traum bros...Robert
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
That's the way to prove your point, brother! Sounds like an old Andy Griffith Show episode, don't it?
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Well Nate there's plenty of cracked folk out there and their not just on the internet, though that internet thing does give them a forum to remove all doubt if anyone seems to be questioning their ability to think. Over the years, folk have hexed me, the Klan vandalized my stuff, tried to through a log through a picture window when I settled some refugee's from Vietnam, slashed my tires. Some witchy types put a couple of spells on me and scratched all sorts of nutty stuff on the church walls, and once tried to fill my driveway with nails. Point is, don't give up doing what your doing 'cause sooner later they'll find someone else to try to drive crazy.
Frankly, I think what you do is amazing and often times makes my day.......besides your giving that other Nate a break.
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I was an invited to a Baptist Church in my younger day in NC. One Sunday evening a big controversy broke when a visiting Seminary student played a guitar and a delegation of Deacons had a pure fit, yelling about no Stringed instruments and all that sort of thing. Well,being a Methodist at the time and finishing up at the Seminary at Wake Forest I got dragged into that hoopla.
Since they had a Piano up and the platform near a couple of double doors I told those characters they might be right and told them to follow me and waltzed them over to those double doors and told them to hold 'em open and proceeded to push that Piano towards those doors. Since that would entail Grandma's piano having to survive a 4 ft drop they commenced to yelling stop, what was I doing etc. I told them Piano's had strings and if they were right it had to go since their point was that stringed instruments were of the Devil a Piano sure had a bunch of them. The mess simmered down after that...........on the way out I couldn't help but sort of innocently asked what David's harp used to make music since I was a bit perplexed by the whole situation.
The Piano stayed and I never did get an answer..........
updated by @salt-springs: 08/31/24 09:28:12PM
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I'm not much of a historian.
But here in my area a lot of Churches didn't allow music of any kind until the late 80s, early 90s. With the exception of Church of God, Pentecostal Churches and Holiness Churches, the only churches that allowed music had a piano and that's it.
To this day the Primitive Baptist and Old Regular Baptist still don't allow music.
However, some of the best musicians in the area went to most of the churches that didn't allow music.
For instance: well known bluegrass player and singer named Ralph Stanley was of the Primitive Baptist denomination that doesn't allow music in church.
I personally wouldn't put much stock in the notion that the early dulcimore was played in church very much. Or any instrument for that matter if we're speaking the 1800s in rural Appalachia.
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Strumelia:
They must be a total weirdo.
I am guessing that's probably an understatement LOL. I have to assume that when he looked up "nate dulcimer" my account happened to come up, and I cant even imagine why he is so mad at the life choices of some hammered dulcimer player in the first place...
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
They must be a total weirdo.
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
More than anything, I find it really funny that someone clicked on a bunch of my videos, and after seeing me a dozen times, still thought I was Nate Pultorak, the middle aged, white, bearded hammered dulcimer player. I guess they were so angry they didn't even glance at the videos?
updated by @nate: 08/31/24 09:49:17AM
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Agreed, Strumelia! When I see someone that angry and vitriolic I have a lot of pity for them. I'm sorry to hear that someone was that vile to you. Luckily for me this person is just unwell and most of their comments made absolutely no sense, so it doesn't affect me that much. He was saying such extremely specific things that I had to google it to find out who he thought I was.
updated by @nate: 08/31/24 09:32:30AM
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Thank you for your kind words Robin. I honestly have never received a mean comment on a video, so I was very shocked to see that someone had gone through my videos to leave a mean comment on each one, and I was totally blown away when I realized that this person is very specifically angry at some other dulcimer player named Nate. 
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Wow. That's pretty pathetic to leave multiple nasty messages on your videos. It feels icky, but sometimes we just have to say "I'd sure hate to have to BE that person!". I had a nasty online stalker once do that on my YT videos too, and on my blogs. I had to shut down my comment features for a year. I think they must have just shriveled up and blown away by now, it happened quite a few years ago.
I'm glad you have lots of good and positive friends here Nate!
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
Oh, my lands, Nate! Like you, I hope the guy finds some peace. It's hard to imagine anyone seeing anything but goodness on your YT videos of your mountain dulcimer builds.
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
I really hope the guy who typed all these messages finds the Lord, and finds peace in their heart. However I couldn't help but to laugh at seeing that someone left really mean comments on a dozen of my videos, and they apparently are mad at someone else. The internet is a funny place.
updated by @nate: 08/31/24 07:27:18AM
Angry internet people, so hateful that it's funny to me
OFF TOPIC discussions
A very angry guy left a bunch of mean comments on tons of my YouTube videos, and after reading several, I realized that this disturbed man thought I was the esteemed hammered dulcimer player named Nate Pultorak. 
Some folks are too angry too see straight 
updated by @nate: 08/31/24 07:31:25AM
Reasons NOT To Get a Chromatic
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
granto:
However, alluding to Shakespeare, what we call the instrument doesn't change what it is, its value, or its place in the musical world.
A mere by any other name would sound as dulce." -Grant Shakespeare
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I agree with Wally regarding his statement about Robin Clark not really understanding the place of the dulcimer within Appalachian culture. But, I think that is true of many of us. The temptation is to generalize e.g., because community A had a play party where a few people played dulcimer, all play parties included dulcimer playing. Appalachia is a diverse region culturally. Some religious groups did not allow musical instruments in worship and developed wonderful a cappella singing. Others that had organs and/or pianos developed great choral (choir) traditions.
When we speak of a specific practice we need to identify its place (Knott County, KY; Galax, VA; Watauga County, NC; etc.). We cannot generalize that practice to other communities without evidence of that practice in those other communities. We tend to pick up a practice and romanticize it. While historians look for evidence to support various notions we have about the mountain dulcimer, its origins, use, place in community, etc., we continue to tell what we "learned" about the dulcimer as unsupported "facts." We all like good stories. I think we need to be careful about the stories we tell. Do they share facts or continue myths? I've learned over the years to be careful in sharing my research in to dulcimer history. I ask myself what substantiates what I am sharing. If I can't accurately state something as fact, I will present it as theory yet to be proven.
Ken
"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."
Reasons NOT To Get a Chromatic
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
granto:The dulcimer community will be the healthiest when we all value the music everyone makes, whether it's like our own or not.
Amen, brother. 
Reasons NOT To Get a Chromatic
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Been a bit since this thread was active but I enjoyed reading and thinking about it.
I think it's worth pointing out this discussion is really just about names. Whether some instrument is a "dulcimer" or not simply depends on how we define "dulcimer". Of course we will disagree on that. Should "dulcimer" be used in the strictest sense, or allowed to be used more broadly, referring to any instrument that had it's beginnings at least partially with the dulcimer? There cannot be agreement on this question because it is a matter of opinion.
Honestly I don't think it matters. The purpose of words and names is to communicate. As long as there is no confusion of communication then the names serve their purpose. If I say "chromatic dulcimer" and everyone knows exactly what I'm referring to, that is sufficient. Of course we could discuss whether to use the term "dulcimer" or not. However, alluding to Shakespeare, what we call the instrument doesn't change what it is, its value, or its place in the musical world. Every instrument in the dulcimer world has it's strengths and weaknesses. Furthermore, everyone sees the relationships between different varieties of dulcimers differently because they all have different experiences.
I totally agree with OverDrive; every instrument you play affects how you play other instruments. NateBuildsToys points out how he played the diatonic dulcimer first and later played the chromatic dulcimer, which then affected his view of the diatonic dulcimer.
NateBuildsToys:
OverDrive:
Whenever I take up a new instrument, it gives me a fresh perspective on the other instruments I play.
It's funny that you mention this. My experience with chromatic dulcimer is that it enhances my perspective of diatonic dulcimer. The cultural place of chromatic and diatonic dulcimers might be different, but to me, as a self taught dulcimer player, chromatic dulcimer provides me with useful contextual information that I can apply to diatonic. Specifically, hearing the ways that the same chords that I play in diatonic can fit into other keys helps me to think of them with a more open mind.
Nate
However, Dusty Turtle played chromatic instruments first, and later played the diatonic dulcimer. Because of this, his experience learning the diatonic dulcimer was very different than it is for others.
Dusty Turtle:
I think of diatonic and chromatic dulcimers as two roads that lead to different kinds of attractions along the way. One will mainly take you to traditional music, both modal and pentatonic, and the other leads you to pop, blues, and jazz. Both can cross over a little bit, but they have different emphases.
Of course, I mainly play a dulcimer with 6+ and 1+ frets, so I've chosen a kind of middle path. I play mostly diatonic music but can occasionally add blue notes or switch keys in ways that would be much more difficult on a truly diatonic instrument.
I would like to caution us all not to assume generalizations hold for everyone. I played the guitar, mandolin, and ukulele before discovering the dulcimer, and the diatonic fretboard did not make the instrument easier to learn. On the contrary, the fact that I could not play so many of the songs in my head was very frustrating. It took about 2 years of playing everyday for me to get a sense of what melodies could be found on the diatonic fretboard and what couldn't. (It may be true that there are no wrong notes on the dulcimer, but that doesn't mean that all the right ones are there!)
And chording on the diatonic fretboard is more complex. On a chromatic fretboard, a chord shape will be the same type of chord as you move up and down the fretboard, but on a diatonic dulcimer, that chord shape changes between major and minor. That fact significantly slows down the development of dulcimer players who wish to play chords.
For me personally, I learned the diatonic dulcimer as my first instrument. My understanding of the diatonic fretboard has shaped my entire understanding of music theory and how I play any musical instrument. I see the keys on the piano in terms of numbers from a dulcimer fretboard. When playing even a six or seven string instrument, whether guitar-like, zither-like or otherwise, I understand the tuning in terms of groups of three strings I can recognize as dulcimer tunings such as DAD, DAA, or DGD. For me, the diatonic dulcimer is absolutely fundamental to music, so when I play a chromatic dulcimer, I instinctively think of it as an extension of the dulcimer. Yet I know not everyone thinks this way. The cool thing is, that means I and other people have very different musical ideas, and we can learn from each other.
Whether you want to play a chromatic dulcimer or not is totally up to you. People will be attracted to different instruments (including types of dulcimers) for a variety of reasons, whether natural playing style, preferred sound, desired musical genere, etc. I think the important thing is that we all make music. The value of us all making music together is we get to see everyone's unique approach and individual ideas, and learn from each other. I want to value and preserve the traditions of past generations, and explore new ideas at the same time. There are things I can do with a chromatic that I can't with a diatonic, and vice versa. Both have an important place. I love the stuff I do on the chromatic dulcimer, because it's just plain fun! I also love playing the diatonic dulcimer. Then again, I can't even play noter style, but I love that sound and am so thankful for people who play it well. In both cases, we're all making music, we just don't do it in the same way or with the exact same instrument. The dulcimer community will be the healthiest when we all value the music everyone makes, whether it's like our own or not.
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Not sure exactly what time period we are talking here- during or before before Jean's time (b.1922)? Remember that the earliest mtn dulcimer so far that has been accurately dated was from the 1830s- actual mtn dulcimers may not even have been 'invented' before 1800.
I've always been doubtful about the conjecture that mountain dulcimers were commonly played for social dances or in church. I've never read any verified references of it, and it seems unlikely to me. On the other hand, many churches and most grange halls had a piano. And guitars, fiddles, and (to a lesser extent) banjos... were pretty widespread among the communities.
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Wally Venable:
He proposes that the dulcimer was commonly used for dances and church services. I have seen no evidence that dulcimers from our area were ever used in dances or church.
I know only a little about dulcimer history, and even less about the history of southern churches, but with smaller churches it makes a lot of sense to me that musicians would be invited to play small intimate performances in front of their congregation. Most church people that I've met love musicians bringing their instruments and performing a piece of worship music, since church is fundamentally about community. I guess i had assumed that any instruments which weren't considered "of the devil" would end up getting played in churches. I really hope it wasn't that different in 'puritanical' times in Appalachia...
updated by @nate: 08/30/24 06:31:24AM
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Thanks for your insight Wally.
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Yes, old dulcimers were quiet instruments, almost always played in the home. No big concerts back then. They were just meant to accompany singing, like Jean Ritchie demonstrated.
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
I watched Robin Clark's video. He does a great job of covering dulcimer types and construction, and he plays with great skill.
On the other hand, I don't think he really understands the place(s) of the dulcimer within Appalachian culture. He proposes that the dulcimer was commonly used for dances and church services. I have seen no evidence that dulcimers from our area were ever used in dances or church.
Both from reading Jean Ritchie's Singing Family of the Cumberlands book (Eastern Kentucky) and from studying local sources (North Central West Virginia) I am aware that in many communities dancing to instrumental music was considered sinful. This was particularly true among rural Methodist and Baptist congregations. In those communities "children" of all ages attended PLAYS or PLAY-PARTIES where dance-like activities took place while the participants SANG the music.
There are many scholarly and semi-scholarly books which discuss play-parties in detail. In many cases the tunes and dance figures were nearly identical to fiddle tunes and square or line dances.
Dulcimers were not more affordable than fiddles and banjos. Both box and gourd homemade fiddles and banjos were used by others (Presbyterians and Anglicans ??) within the same areas for dancing.
As to dulcimer playing in church, I'd guess that it occurred on occasions, but it was unnecessary. The Ritchies, and probably most other Methodists and Baptists, learned highly structured unaccompanied singing in shape-note schools and from the Sacred Harp schools. It is quite possible that many of the small churches had foot-pumped organs, there was one in the Ritchie home.
If anyone has primary source material describing dulcimer playing at dances or in church, I'd like to see it.
Play Music On The Porch Day 2019
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
We have internet disruptions frequently due to, I think, extreme heat/demand on the power grid. Our plan is loose: make music, record it some way on whatever day works, and put it on the internet.
Happy strumming, friends!
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Robin has been a member here for years, although he hasn't participated much recently. He's a great dulcimer player and innovative builder.
Play Music On The Porch Day 2019
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Robin Thompson:
The 2024 edition of worldwide Play Music On The Porch Day is Saturday 31 August! Make music where you can when you can, friends! (Not everyone can go outdoors to play nor is everyone available on the actual stated date.)
Glad you brought it up! This year is slipping by far too fast I almost let it blow past me!
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Thanks for posting this, sir!
History of mountain dulcimer
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Just thought someone may find this interesting. History and tradition of the mountain dulcimer. By Robin Clark
Play Music On The Porch Day 2019
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
Unfortunately, I'll be traveling this year, but I'll come up with some way to mark the day and share some music.
Magic Mountain 469-H Dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
https://issuu.com/dulcimerplayersnewsinc/docs/120823165315-a345f3453f974f1190310a94462246b7
Go to page 25 or run a search on the issue that comes up, enter Magic Mountain
updated by @salt-springs: 08/24/24 09:23:00PM
Magic Mountain 469-H Dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Salt Springs:
https://fotmd.com/forums/forum/general-mountain-dulcimer-or-music-discussions/20342/does-anyone-know-when-my-mountain-dulcimer-was-built
I heard from JC years ago when checking one out......if I remember there might be a number stamped in the wood somewhere that could give you an idea as to when it was made. I just don't remember. People that have owned them, some on this site, swear by them.
Magic Mountain 469-H Dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
I heard from JC years ago when checking one out......if I remember there might be a number stamped in the wood somewhere that could give you an idea as to when it was made. I just don't remember. People that have owned them, some on this site swear by them.
updated by @salt-springs: 08/24/24 09:00:18PM
Magic Mountain 469-H Dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Here are the photos. It's not mine, one I might be interested in.
Magic Mountain 469-H Dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Pictures would help. Especially a close up of the Maker's label inside the instrument.
Play Music On The Porch Day 2019
General mountain dulcimer or music discussions
The 2024 edition of worldwide Play Music On The Porch Day is Saturday 31 August! Make music where you can when you can, friends! (Not everyone can go outdoors to play nor is everyone available on the actual stated date.)
Magic Mountain 469-H Dulcimer
Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions
Hello all. Does anyone know any information about this model, made by the Shellnut Company, as Magic Mountain, in the San Francisco area, probably in the late 1970's or early 80's?
I'd appreciate any details, information, guidance or informed opinions.
Thanks all!
updated by @comixchik: 08/24/24 08:49:55PM