Forum Activity for @kusani

And being a novice, I am interested in seeing pics of various stands, tables, players use.  I am finding a stand, table, much easier than playing in my lap. 

Electronic tuners are good to get the root note but after that its always better to tune the dulcimer to itself. Unless someone has invented a tuner that hears the suttle nuances...

Everyone should own at least one dulcimer with wood pegs. Preferably a set that's properly installed... Robert...

I agree that it is easier just to tune by ear.  However, a Korg OT-120 does have several historic temperaments in addition to equal temperament, plus a movable pitch.  

The Roland Micro Cube and Orange Crush Micro are a bit smaller, size and power, and both have pretty good reviews. I've been considering them and the Danelectro Honeytone, a really inexpensive and small amp. I have a Crate 15 watt, but it is larger and, heavier, than your Mini.

20" scale is a G dulcimer. Ment to be played with light gauge strings in Gdg tuning. Put a capo on your dulcimer at the third fret, retune down to Dad and listen. It won't sound quite as good. Adding heavier strings makes a small dulcimer grone not drone... Robert...

Hi Susie. I don't have a battery powered amp, but I do have a Loudbox Mini. I'm not sure how much sound you are looking for from the amp. A 1 watt, 3 watt, or 5 watt battery powered amp will not give you the punch of the Mini. Having said that, I have heard good things from the Roland Mobile Cube. Here is a link describing it: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MobileCube One of my friends has one and uses it primarily in small groups of around 20 people in a room about the size of a typical school room.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Don't underestimate the power of the false nut. I keep a spare in my wallet...

Beware of Bluegrassers they are their own kind of people, sometimes getting unsettled around dulcimers in a jam... Robert  

Marg said the dulcimer she's interested in was built in 1981.

Well, with ANY Warren May dulcimer, but especially those after 1980 -- when he began commonly using Equal Temperment and 6+ frets to placate 'modern' buyers -- I would specifically ASK him if theparticular instrument is Just Intonated or Equal Temperment.

I said; ..."you might experiment with 18 and 16 for the mid and melody strings. -  with that short of VSL (20"), 12 gauge strings would be too light for the A.)

Marg asked: Will heavier strings than 12 be harder to fret or will they give the dulcimer a deeper sound? Would the lighter strings (12 or under) be floppy or wrong tension or break or why do we go heavier?

That's a Looooonnnggggg story involving physics of strings, math and other nasty subjects.  The upshot is that strings heavier than 12 ga at that VSL should not be harder to fret.  String of 12 gauge or less on that short of VSL will be floppy (not enough tension).  You need heavier strings at that VSL to get the proper amont of tension.

From Bagpipe Ddd I go to Gdd by using a false nut on the 3rd fret of the bass string.

I would also add to Robs answer by saying. I tune my baritone DOWN to Gdd and Gdg. And take advantage of both octaves. Putting me in the same range as guitar/banjo... Robert. 

I have a Fishman Loudbox Mini that I use with my instruments that works very well. However, sometimes there's a need for a very small amp that is battery powered. It wouldn't be for large venues, just to get some amplification, like in a small group. The ideal would be something that would also work with my guitars that have active pickups. My dulcimer has an internal soundboard passive pickup.

Does anyone use one of these mini acoustic combo amps that is battery powered? If so, what do you like/dislike? I'm thinking under $200 would be the price range I'm considering. 

Mark, Dusty's option of using a capo is quite viable.  I use one myself, sometimes.  However, depending on what's being played, I'd rather retune.  I read an interview in DPN with Alan Freeman where he said something to the effect that we're already "missing" frets so why would you want to shorten the fingerboard with a capo and make more frets unusable?  Even tho' I was using a capo a lot at the time, that thought stuck with me.  I'm trying to play a lot of tunes/songs in the correct key without using a capo and staying (like Dusty) in DAd tuning.  [To reiterate what he said, the lower case d just means it's an octave above the bass D.]  I play Down Yonder and Silver Bells (not the Christmas one, the Mexican Polka) in G and You'll Never Leave Harlan Alive in A without either retuning or using a capo.  If'n I'm just going to be chording, playing rhythm, like Dusty (again,) I play barre chords without using a capo or retuning for G and A tunes.

I usually take (at least) 2 instruments to jams: 1 tuned DAd, 1 tuned DAA, both of them 3 courses.  The DAd I can tune to G DGd, A minor EAd, D minor DAc and the DAA I can tune to A major EAA or D minor DAG all with moving only one string.  If I take a 3rd instrument, it will be tuned to G, either a Jim Good in his special G tuning or a small 4 string Paul Pyle tuned GDDg.

You see, you've got options.  That's something that makes this instrument really cool and also really frustrating (as in capo or retune or another instrument, yeah that's the one!) at the same time.  Those folks that like things really cut and dry can have a problem getting their heads around such things.  LOL.  Well, I've probably confused you enough for now.  Keep picking

Mark, I play in a modern chording style and what I would do is put a capo on the third fret. Then you can pretend you are playing in D but you will actually be in G.  You can also put the capo on the fourth fret to play in A. For me that's easier than learning DGd tuning, which requires new fingering for the chords.

Most bluegrass tunes have a standard key. Billy in the Lowground is always played in C.  Saint Anne's Reel is always played in D.  Blackberry Blossom is always played in G.  Red-haired Boy is always played in A.  When I practice songs that I expect to play in bluegrass jams I always try to practice them in the standard key.  And since I am one of those unimaginative people who mainly plays in DAd, I can get all those keys pretty easily.  I tune down to CGc for the key of C, but the other three keys I can get out of DAd with a handy capo.

The lower case d in DGd just indicates that the melody string is an octave above the bass string.

Barre chords are a good idea, especially if you are playing the role of the mandolin, where you want that fast percussive chop.  You get that chop from lifting up your fingers right after striking the chord to stop the notes from ringing. You don't actually take your fingers off the strings, but merely stop pressing them onto the fretboard so that your fingers mute the sound. And if you don't know a chord or two, just mute the strings and strum anyway. If you stay on beat no one will mind.

 (probably be used for solo play rather than ensemble play)

I am hoping to start playing where you hear more of the sweet sounds that come out of the dulcimer, when I am at practice or a jam everything is at warp speed. Such fast strums - they drown out what the strings can do. Sight unseen still with the Warren May - till next week, I am hoping it will be the dulcimer for this. I have been practicing a few songs for when I am able to see & try out the dulcimer. With this discussion I feel very ready for this W. May dulcimer adventure with it's wooden pegs, short VSL and no 6.5

I watched a short video by robin on 3 dulcimers in different temperaments. And you right ken, I'm not at a point for understanding but it was good seeing the video and will help when I read some of the post. 

A year ago there was a good bit more I didn't understand but with all the post and videos I feel I am coming alone. With help form the members here, I have been able to set up the used dulcimers I come across (like the red stain one), repair them, make adjustments till they find their voice - learning as I go.

I find it interesting members could be an hour away or half way around the world but all are as near by as my laptop and this site. Thank you all 

kevin,

thanks for your reply. 

(what sounds good to you, and what you want to try.)

    Ha, I think many dulcimers sound good and I wouldn't mind trying many or at lease see them.  

ken,

Your answers are always great but sometimes they lead me to more questions:

(IF that Warren May instrument is one of his older (pre-80s)

1981

(might experiment with 18 and 16 for the mid and melody strings. -  with that short of VSL, 12 gauge strings would be too light for the A.)

Will heavier strings than 12 be harder to fret or will they give the dulcimer a deeper sound? Would the lighter strings (12 or under) be floppy or wrong tension or break or why do we go heavier?

Thanks, as always

Mary, I would like to say most modern instruments are fretted in equal Temperament. Mean tone fretting is just a slight shift in tone and is a little more sweet sounding than ET. JI is another way of fretting that Gives you an even sweeter tone,at least most who try will tell you. I have used all three on my instruments, and prefer JI for noter style playing , just sound's better to me. As Ken said ,it has nothing to do with extra frets.  JI instruments can be played in most tunnings, but  I have found some sound better than others. I usually use a 155 tuning, usually DAA.  I have found that in that tuning a playing with others in D that they play well together.  It's all about what sounds good to you,and what you want to try.

Mark, I would use DGd, tuning down the middle string from A to G.  All D's will work, too.  Makes the G on the 3rd fret. 

Yes JI is Just Intonation -- a system for laying out frets which is different than the Mean Tone system used for modern instruments.

JI has nothing to do with having, or not having, a 6+ fret.  Until now (I'm building a dulcimer with JI fret spacing) I've never had or played a JI instrument.  But I've also never built or played instruments with 6+frets (well, just a few). 

On dulcimers with JI fret layouts, notes are just a bit 'sweeter' to the ears, than the same notes on the same frets of a Mean Tone dulcimer.  Mean Tone is more or less world-wide, and allows instrument from many different places/builders/cultures to play together more easily.  In a group of instruments where most are Mean Tone, a JI instrument will sound "off" when playing a scale alongside a Mean Tone.

At this point in your dulcimer journey, I honestly don't think you should even think about JI vs Mean Tone, except in this respect -- IF that Warren May instrument is one of his older (pre-80s), JI layout dulcimers, understand that it should probably be used for solo play rather than ensemble play.  Not all Warren May dulcimers are JI.  Not all have a 6+ fret. 

You also asked about string gauges for a 20" VSL:   "If I was in DAA i would have 18 & 18 for the AA's? Is 12's too way off, since that is what Warren said he would used, or could he have forgotten it's a small size - is there a size good for both or either tunings DAA & DAd?"

Yes, with that short of VSL, 12 gauge strings would be too light for the A.  Warren may not have remembered the VSL correctly.  Strings that work well for A also, generally work with d as well.  Or you might experiment with 18 and 16 for the mid and melody strings.

ken

   Still trying to understand some of the discussion above:

Does  JI" mean just intonation? And that would be with no 6+ fret and is best in DAA or 1-5-5 tunings? Could not having a 6.5 fret be anything else or is it always just intonation? 

Sorry, I am slow at understanding this

Thanks patty, but I'm not worry about the dulcimer I am getting, just looking for how to info. since I have not had a dulcimer with wooden pegs before. I have gotten lots of good info from this post from when the pegs may slip or stick and what to do if they do. I have other dulcimers that have gears, this dulcimer will be my first with wooden pegs. 

Robert, it's fun solving problems like that.  Nice. :)

I have a peg reamer but never could get pegs to work well because commercially made pegs were never a perfect match. So I built this simple peg shaft sander  out of scrap maple. Now pegs work much better. Look at the two pegs. One is reshaped the other raw... Robert.

 IMG_20160108_105546_795.jpg - 122KB

Thank you so much, Joy. I'll do my best this year, I promise!

Marg, I was in your place a couple of years ago. I almost didn't purchase my Prichard or any replica for fear of the wood pegs. Rob showed me how to tune wood pegs and took away the fear I had. I think I was more apprehensive in my mind than what the pegs were actually doing. Keep in mind that wood pegs are wood and they'll act like wood. On humid days they'll absorb a bit more moister on dry days they lose a bit. I've never had a problem with sticking. I do have problem with slipping from time to time. When that happens I put a bit of moister on the peg near the hole...and no, I don't use spit (try not to, LOL). It works. The more you play your instrument and learn it the more you will get accustomed to tuning it. Personally, I like to leave my Prichard in DAA because that is what I typically like to play. If you go to jam sessions you may want to invest in a dulcimer with geared tuners so you can switch tuning quickly and with ease. Having said that, the group I play with stays pretty much in DAd . Just a side note, and forgive me Randy, I personally wouldn't sand my pegs. If you are not experienced in wood working you may sand too much off and the pegs will have problems seating. Once you take wood away you can't put it back at least not original. And for those of you with arthritic hands I completely understand why you need geared tuners. 

my 2 cents....I never use peg dope/chalk/soap etc on my wooden pegs. They work good with nuthin. If they started acting up I'd try a remedy....if they were slipping I'd rough 'em up a little with sandpaper....if they were sticking I'd polish the pegs and the hole. Tried a substance 20 years or so ago and didn't like it....felt spongy.....once you use something you gotta keep using it....you never know....I'd use a substance if I had to....

There's only 2 strings to tune right? One of the three is already in tune! 

When I had younger, healthier hands I enjoyed my wooden-pegged beauties. 

Thanks Dan and Robin; the encouragement helps. :)

I like that word "kinaesthetic", Robin.  It is very satisfying when you coax the strings into tune.  It gives one the feeling of accomplishment.

The peg drops I use are "Regal Peg Drops" sold by Regal Music, Ely, MN. I got it thru Ebay and I think it cost about $5.00 for a 2 oz. bottle.  I have 5 dulcimers with pegs and have used about 1/4 of the bottle in 5 years.  Just a drop goes a long way.

I use wooden pegs on many dulcimers and enjoy the kinaesthetic process of tuning. It sort of connects me to the instrument before I start playing. I tend to tune by ear as it is easier than using a tuner. Most of the instruments I have are not in equal temperament so a tuner is not accurate anyway.

my first was a kit i bought from a gift shop here in branson about 1970.  it was a box of parts with no instructions.  i put it togther and while it

didnt look like much it sounded pretty good......at least to me.  as it turned out i became more interested in building dulcimers than playing them

and launched a 30 year business.  it became a wonderful life style traveling to arts and craft shows and music festivals.

 Carol,

( I bought a mountain dulcimer from a dulcimer craftsmen in Berea, Ky. )

I'm thinking you have a Warren May dulcimer. You could call his shop and talk to him about the peg problem if you still have the same problem from this post. He is very friendly and helpful. He also changes out his pegs to gears for his customers if you live anywhere around Berea. Good luck, hope to hear how it goes. Welcome back

Good luck to you Kusani, and I must say, I love your dulcimer, it is beautiful.

Good for you, Kusani.  Your dulcimer voyage begins . . . 

Thanks for the encouragement Jan.  Here is a pic. of my Maxwell; as well as the antler noter, custom to fit my hand, I made today. I'm determined to learn on this instrument, despite the wood peg frustration  Later I may upgrade if I learn to play decently. :)

no robert, I can't. Nice work.

Beautiful Maxwell dulcimers

My first, and only so far, dulcimer was purchased by my mother in 1976 when she visited John Maxwell's dulcimer and craft shop in Cookeville, Tn.  She never played it and it has been hanging on my wall for the past 30 years.  Day before yesterday I took it down, cleaned it up, started reading volumes on line, went to a music shop and had it restrung and learned about the difficulty of tuning with wood pegs.  I also made the noter today, using some deer antler I had in my shop.  Learned what DADD tuning is, and last night started practicing on a couple of simple songs.  I am scheduled to start lessons at church week after next.  Wish me luck. :)  The last musical instrument I played was a trombone in high school. 

   Practicing 'Ave Maria' there are a few 6+ needed and I am doing a bit of it all. There is one point on the middle string where I slide from 4 to 5 to 9 back down to 5 than 4 than 1 to 2. Beautiful, another point I can do a chord and one point I leave alone and just let the last note ring. All going nice, so when I get the little dulcimer with no 6.5, I will be ready and yes, happy with however I play it.

Thanks so much, you guys are great

m.