Forum Activity for @strumelia

Here is a video I made demonstrating how I change back and forth between the four most common dulcimer modes (mixolydian, aeolian, ionian, and dorian) in the key of D, by changing the tuning on just the melody string. Sometimes seeing it done feels less complicaed than describing it.

Here's my blog post of it:

Retuning between the modes

and the video itself (r.i.p my kitty Pearl):

Marg; 

Here's a "relative tuning" discussion I got from Jerry Rockwell, years ago, and have added to.  It's from my article I Just Got A Dulcimer, Now What?, and tells you how to change from one tuning to another, among the four most common Modal tunings.  All you do is change one string...

Ionian Mode is called the "natural major" mode. (called DAA if the Keynote is D).  Most traditional American songs you can sing or hum are 'natural major' tunes.

1. Tune the bass string of the dulcimer to D or a note that sounds good with your voice… not to low or too high.
2. Press the bass string just to the left of the 4th fret and pluck the string. Tune the middle string so it exactly matches this note.
3. Tune the melody string(s) to the same note as the un-fretted (open) middle string.

Aeolian  is the "natural minor" mode.  (called DAC if the Keynote is D).  Many traditional Scottish and Irish tunes sound
good in this 'weeping and wailing' mode. Wayfaring Stranger, Good King Wenceslas, and ShadyGrove/Mattie Groves are well known Aeolian songs.

Steps 1 and 2 are the same as for Ionian.
Step 3. Press the bass string at the 6th fret and pluck it. Tune the melody string(s) to this note.

Mixolydian (called DAd if the Keynote is D).  Mixo mode is only "slightly minor", and is used extensively for neo-celtic music, Irish fiddle tunes, and the masterpieces of Turlough O'Carolan.

Steps 1 and 2 are the same as for Ionian.
Step 3. Press the bass string at the 7th fret and pluck it. The sound is an octave higher than the unfretted bass string. Tune the melody string(s) to this note.

Dorian ( called DAG if the Keynote is D)  Dorian mode is not so minor sounding as Aeolian Mode, but more so than Mixolydian. Barbara Allen,
Scarborough Fair, and Greensleeves are well known Dorian tunes.

Steps 1 and 2 are the same as for Ionian.
Step 3. Press the bass string at the 3rd fret and pluck this note. Tune the melody string to this note.

The above is why I so appreciate tab found on ED and the like: Earlier on I bought a few books and even bought a couple based solely upon a particular song or two that the book contained.  Only later to find out that instead of the much more common DAdd (double dd for Marg), they were in some backwoods passed down for generations family mode and tuning.  That did me absolutely no good whatsoever.  There for awhile I had some success with a computer program called Finale of which I had for other music interests.  When a group was playing at the church I'd arrange the hymn to the instruments that were available.  This was all in standard music notation as that's what most if not all played in for their respective instruments.  The dulcimer was of course the odd bird of the bunch (I couldn't even play standard notation on the dulcimer and had to have tab).  After I'd arrange the score I'd separate the parts and print them out and when I had my part indicidualized I'd convert it to tab. (on that version of Finale it was a simple "Select All" and then click the "Convert to Tab" button.  Boy was I spoiled for awhile.

Another thing I'd often notice was that if a fellow hated fretting on the first or second fret all the time (in say DAdd "double dd for Marg") rather than use a capo, they'd just tighten up the strings a bit and call it the "Johnson Ol Tyme Mode" and be done with it.  I swear I didn't think that there were that many modes for the dulcimer at all?  Quite often a book will have you tighten or loosen a string (or all the strings) a number of pitches (just asking for a broken string) and back again just to play yet another song.  One book I had there were only two songs that were in the same mode.  Every song had it's own unique mode to play it in.  Now maybe that book was an introduction to those varioous modes, but as a book, it stunk big time.  That's what I don't understand.  If you look at the available instruments and how they are strung as sold and then the music books that follow, a majority are in teh DAdd.  So why is there an insistance on producing all of the other tab that is more problematic than helpful to the rest of the folks?   DAaa is the very next most popular and found tuning and I've seen a number of books mainly written in that mode, but you can't single out just one mode it seems.  Every book I've bought even a Mel Bay book on the DAdd tuning had a load of other tunings in it.  That made no sense at all.  It would be like buying an english book that was written in spanish?  Go figure?  Kevin.

    Yes, it's exciting to explore with the idea it will help you find the path that's right for you at that point in time. And you are right all the modes, tunes and keys were something I knew nothing about - but so ready to jump right in and learn. 

   I had already practiced a few DGD songs with the group I'm with and was excited to find out I could play the DAA tabs - melody line in this tuning. So, I tuned my student dulcimer to DGD and tried some out but was not excited with the tone.

    Looking through a dulcimer handbood, that was beyond me half a year ago - I found several songs in the different tunings. I went ahead and retuned to DDDG. Ha, it took me about 3 tries to get it right, first I had it all upside down with the G on the melody string. Than the G on the base was not the right G. finnally I got it and played 'Shenandoah' and it really sounded nice. I then played it on my dulcimer tuned DAdd and realized the melody line was the same tab only slight difference, since it was written by someone else. Some of the cords in DDDG are not hard and the ones that are, I just use my thumb like a noter on those and would slide back and forth between the notes. I found this very exciting, where I didn't care for DGD I thought DDDG was very nice.

    AS I begin to explore this part of learning more of what the dulcimer and I can do - since I am at a 4 not a 10 - as strumelia mention in her post; I know I can't do them all at once but I have a start. The biggest problem I see now more than having tabs is not knowing how to tune to the tunnings. Which strings would be below or above middle C. But I feel, just like tonight when the time is right, I will get it and be excited.

    It is an exciting journey, I think that is my path right now. Breathing life into my soul and seeing where the dulcimer takes me. 

I really do appreciate all of your answers. Life has been ridiculously busy lately, and since I am utterly new to playing an instrument and getting obsessed, I am finding I have many, many questions. when I read reviews of pics or mics or other things, often times, the reviewer is not a dulcimer player. I highly value the opinion of the experienced. Thank you again. 

Sometimes when I'm learning something new that involves a lot of information and variations, it begins to feel too overwhelming yet I naturally want to understand it all right away, so I can make decisions about what path I want to follow or explore.  When I get that feeling of being overwhelmed by my lack of knowledge I tend to ask questions that get me answers I don't yet understand anyway.  That's because I want to know about points 9, 10, and 11 without really understanding points 3, 4 and 5 yet.   For myself, I do best when I then focus on the basics before diving into trying to understand lots of finer points all at once.  I find that my knowledge tends to build on itself like a tower of blocks, and it sticks in my head better that way too.  :)

Marg, you're idea is exactly what I use to do.  In printing out available DAd tab off of ED, I had a really tought heavy duty binder (D ring about 2" thick) and a three hole punch.  Alphabetized, punched, and filed for later use.  After awhile I got quite the collection of tab in my very own tab book.  Kevin.

Well, ken I'm good to go than since the red stain dulcimer is set up for DAA. Playing by the clover soundhold really makes some interestings tones. 

Marge -- probably 85% of the songs you'll want to learn to play are playable in Ionian Mode -- DAA -- or Bagpipe Ddd.  A few songs require either a 6+ fret or Mixolydian tuning.  There are some special songs that simply can't be played 'properly' in anything except Dorian or Aeolian Mode.  As you explore the music you want to play, you'll find those special songs, and then the tunings that will make them "just right". 

robert,

Your baritones are very handsome, very nice in-deed. 

    Thank you ken, I am amazed when someone can play a song much less a couple hundred. I am what you would call a 'latecomer' as in starting to learn the dulcimer or even music, late in life. I guess when I see or hear something new, (which is much) - I am like a kid in the candy store - wanting more than I could possibly manage at that time.

    I wouldn't want you to go out of your way on  'city of new orleans'. When I saw it listed I went to it right away, new orleans was home - but after katrina  'home' was lost and everything that goes with that concept. Maybe one day, I could just hear you play it. 

    I appreciate your patience with my questions or the asking on some problem (I love the help I received on the red stain dulcimer and felt I learn so much working on it with all the help). The more I learn, the better my question will become hopefully and I wont throw out as many - (Again, I wouldn't want to 'over step' - even without knowing) 

    This discussion was such an eye openner on the different tunings I guess I was just looking for the 'Cliff Notes' to try and catch up on what tuning I would like when I didn't even know there were so many still to try. I sometimes can't believe even what I have been able to do so far and look forwartd to this dulcimer journey i'm on and where it is taking me. 

    Thank you for your kindness and now - back to the tunings and what the members like.                                                           

Kevin I'm glad you mentioned baritones. Because in a way, baritone is a kind of tuning in itself. Although I don't play is as much, my 30" scale baritone is just the thing when you need that boomchucka sound... Here is a picture of my baritone along side my regular work a day dulcimer. And an uncompleted hourglass baritone. Tuned in A... Robert...

 IMG_20150815_213335_745.jpg - 91KB

I have one by Robert Schuler and Kevin Messanger and they are the best workmanship and sound, I am very happy with them both. You can talk with either fellow right on this site and they will treat you right.

No -- you're not "over stepping".  You don't know if you don't ask.  Never be afraid to ask.  There are no dumb or silly questions, just ones you don't get answers to. 

Playing the dulcimer can be as simple or complex as you want to make it.  There's a world of difference in playing songs or tunes in traditional Noter & Drone or Fingerdance style compared to modern Chord-Melody style.  Not everything can be played in DAA, DAd, or Ddd in either style.  Some songs simply require notes or chords you can't find on the fretboard in those tunings. 

I do think folks are more likely to repond to a single tune request rather than a blanket request for tab.  

I will gladly send you City of New Orleans that I've worked out in DAC, but I'll actually have to sit down and write it out.  I don't personally collect tab, as once I've learned a song and written it down in the process of working out the tune,  it's added to the couple hundred songs in my "internal software" (brain) and I can play on demand.  So the old envelope or napkin that I recorded the tab on gets discarded. 

Marg, we all have something to learn, no matter where we are on this journey. 

Sorry if you felt in my asking about tabs  (rather than a shotgun request) I was over stepping.

    I didn't even know they had all these modes or tunnings or keys to play in, till I started reading this discussion. As I said, 'Learning as I go'

One step at a time - no worries, I will print out the ones I fine and start a collection and begin to try them out.

Jan, I know the link and it costed my a night sleep already!

Rob, as someone who usually prefers oldtime to jazzier or bluesier stuff, I really wondered whether I would like Dom's new trio, considering it had a 'real' drummer with a full drum set, and a bass fiddle player...sounded like a jazz trio to me.  But they actually played a wide variety of stuff including lots of 1920s-50s depression era songs I liked.  Even their modern stuff they did with lots home grown flair.  It was good!  Dom has tons of energy- the concert was 90 minutes with no break, and with much high energy dance, bones, harmonica, guitar, and some incredible raggy style plectrum banjo playing at warp speed by Dom that was amazing.  He really gives his all, and his two partners add to the fun.  They are all absolute sweethearts.  Rob I know they would enjoy playing with you, you are the real deal.      Their fiddle and bass player Brian found out I play limberjack and told me he always wanted to learn it but didnt know how to get one or get started.  I gave him a simple limberjack i had that was kind of an 'extra' I had, and I showed him the basics...he was so excited!   You can see him happily holding it in the photo I posted.  I bet he would have loved a little dulcimer lesson from you as well.   They are all three just like that- so open and excited about music and people.

Jan- that's a great link to some great music!   I bet you do still have some hidden 'special powers' though...one day you'll swoop into action and we'll all be saved and amazed! 

Nothing pitiful about your playing at all, Rob!  I think I saw the Chocolate Drops when they were on Woodsongs Old Time Radio Hour. (No, I don't have special "powers" to "see" radio.....the shows are taped in a theater in my hometown of Lexington, KY, and the tapings are then shown on TV.  The website also has an archive of all its shows....you can watch Sarah Morgan performing on the same show as the Two Cellos(Show #710, watch Jean Ritchie at a taping, as well as many other greats in the music world...many that are no longer with us.)  http://www.woodsongs.com/show-archives/

Welcome Ron!  The Tamarind noters are all sold, but I'll be having some other hard exotic wood noters available late next week.  I just ordered a mixed bag of raw stock including Bloodwood, Purple Heart, Padauk, Wenge, and Yellowheart, and it should be here by the 19th.

Marg;

There's no "clickable" list of Dorian or Aeolian mode tunes that I know of.  You need to hunt the names down through sites like sniff.numachi, Everything Dulcimer, other player's websites, or ask if someone has specific tab (rather than a shotgun request) that they'll share with you,  in the Dulcimer Resources Discussion here.  There is a lot of DAG and DAC tab in various books by a number of dulcimer players, but it's not free.

Glad you've checked out Uncontrite Modal Folker.  If you have any questions, feel free to as.

You asked " If I have the songs in either DAdd or DAA can I change a number up or down for DAC & DAG. Or is DAG like DGD where we can use the same tab as DAA? Or, any of the other modes can be played on either DAdd or DAA tabs?"

The answer in all cases, unfortunately is NO.  There is no "conversion" from DAA tab to DAC or any of the others.  DAG and DAC are not like DGD (that's a very special case).  No other modes can be played from DAd or DAA tab.  Tab is specific to a particular mode. 

I learned "on my own" for the better part of 20 years, with only Jean Ritchie's Dulcimer Book, and later Force/d'Ossche's In Search of the Wild Dulcimer.

Thanks Ken, I appreciate that.

Sorry I forgot you Kevin.  Your traditional instruments are top notch for sure.

If I could be so bold, you can check out my website, it is all I build . Traditional dulcimers,fretted either Equal Temp. , meantone, or just intonation, no extra frets.   kmdulcimers.com

You bet Jan.  What a great hobbie to be able to entertain one's self.  From my original music training (the clarinet) I soon realized that it by itself was rather boring and depended upon a whole band or orchestra to enjoy  (I know there are exceptions, but I'm talking about my enjoyment) So that is why I learned and favored instruments that in essence were a complete group as it were.  Organ first, accordion, piano, and last but certainly not least the wonderful dulcimer.  Loads of fun indeed.  Kevin.

Great account of your journey with the dulcimer, the decisions you've made along the way and the reasons behind them, Kevin!  I can tell that playing the dulcimer brings you a lot of joy and contentment. 

Speaking of different modes and the like:  Just because of my first dulcimer mode and tuning I've backed that up with tablature and the like and then after a few years I then realized exactly which modes I played in.  Up till that point I just thought that folk changed tuning of individual strings to suit a particular song they wanted to play?  At it's heart that may well be true, but I never wanted to flatten the instrument since it would change everything about the string and it's notes as well as overall, the instruments chords and intervals.  At the time I also played the banjo and found that some were doing much the same with bangos.  Even to the extent that they sell and market a tuning peg that allows detuning to a specific note.  Yep you adjust it to pitch and then tighten a set screw.  Detune the string to the lower desired pitch and tighten yet another set screw.  Then during play you can imediately "detune" the string to the desired lower note and back.  Often there were two strings that detuners were utilized on.  No sure that was clever to bounce down and back up to pitch, but more the detuned tuning was in itself a tuning for the banjo and songs were and can be played in that "detuned" state.

So with the dulcimer as well as the banjo, I was having enough fun/difficulty in learning the one setting let alone confuse it with yet another tuning.  Might as well be learning a completely different instrument as to learn a completely different tuning.  The only thing the dulcimer had going for it was that no matter the detuned state (or simply different mode) it was still a diatonic instrument and for one string or more, for the noter drone folks, it was identical in play.  It's just those darn chords and intervals that get buggered up.  So after looking at what I had and was playing, it seemed as though I had two modes to my belt.

The two moded were 158 Mixilydian and 155 Ionian.  Now that I knew what it was I started collecting instruments in both versions so as to allow play in each.  That was before when I was single to newly married and an eternity ago.  Now as I'm getting back into play and dulcimer ownership, I decided upon the 158 or Mixilydian for my Probst baritone (even though it will be strung in the key of G).  The 158 solely referrs to ratios of the strings against themselves and not the instrument's key.  I then found opportunity after speaking with Ron Ewing of picking up a baritone dulcimette of his in his Aorell shape.  (hourglass towards the player and teardrop on the farthest side.  Oversimplification for sure, but basically correct).  I at first asked it to be tuning to G in the Ionian mode or 155 so that I could play those additional songs.  Well nothing requires a song to have one versus the other to be able to play, but some are just easier on one versus the other.  I then realized that time was short and I didn't really have the time nor energy to learn and continue to work on two seperate tunings and instruments to go along with those tunings.

So last night I decided to change my Ewing order and request it also to be in the Mixalydian mode or 158, still tuned in the key of G.  That way each instrument was the exact same as far as fingering and play.  I can concentrate on that mode and tuning as get, well, better at it.  I will learn those songs (Amazing Grace as an example) that are simple and easy on the 155, to be played in an instrument in the 158 mode.  It is possible after all.  Then my skill will increase far faster than splitting it between two different modes.  And the most important of reasons:  I'd often take a baritone dulcimette on trips and play while my wife drove to doctors appointments in San Francisco.  While I played (when they were different modes) I'd always wish I had the other mode.  When at home playing a larger instrument in 158, I'd wish I had the 155?  I kept swapping instruments and never could just grab the one and play and be happy.  Now with both the same, if at home I'll play the Probst large dulcimer and if when going to bed, I want to play a quick couple of tunes I can still grab the Ewing baritone dulcimette and play in the same mode and be happy.  Also on trips the travel instrument will be the same as the home one and visa versa.  I look forward to receiving each of the two instruments I now have on order and remember that when I had over 25 dulcimers that the Probst and Ewing instruments were the last to go since I enjoyed them the most.  Kevin.

Sheryl, Dom has left the Drops and has his own group now.  I saw one of the last performances up here in Morgantown of the Chocolate Drops with Dom.  It was great!  His new group is probably not to the taste of a lot of old time music lovers, but I like it too.  I'd love to add a dulcimer to either group sometime, if they'd have a pitiful player like me.

Wout, just a little American humor, not unlike our Smileys. 

Not being a native speaker: what is playing bones hamster?

Yes, I know, but this drum was also before 1:47 in the mix... It is the loud clicking of the bones with many a roffle which triggers the automatic gain much too much and the drum isn't :D

I find that even if i practice the bones for 30 minutes a day or for an hour every other day...  well there are some days when everything seems to be clicking pretty well (pun intended) and other days when nothing goes right and I stumble through it all badly.  Ugh!  I get much more consistent practice experiences when i practice other instruments.   I suspect this is just because the learning curve is big for me on this, and am hoping to get more consistent practice experiences as I continue.  I've never ever been one of those kids who tapped their pencils on their desks, so percussion is kind of a challenge.  I did manage to get a pretty good foot tapping thing going after 6 months of determined practice...so i know I can get results with lots of practice.  But percussion has never come naturally for me.  It's real work! 

I think the obvious name would be Ham-Bones.    lolol   

Sheryl, love your new avatar!

Good one Tumbleweed. 

Good to know. I just change my bottom string to a 12 since I had it tune to a. The 9 or 10 that was on it did seemed very slack. 

Learning as I go With great help from all

Hey Lois, 

if you find you want to keep one dulcimer tuned to the key of G in order to sing with better, you could put a set of strings on that dulcimer that is just one step heavier ...as in maybe a .011 or a .012 string instead of a .010 for example.  You would do this if the lower G tuning feels a bit slack.  A slightly heavier string will feel a bit tighter tensioned than a thinner string tuned to the same note.

A Big welcome to father and son! 

Jan gave you some great info on noters.

For some additional ideas about what types of noters one can buy or find and how to hold them , etc, you might enjoy a little video I made about notesrs...

It seems besides trying to learn as much as I can about the dulcimer, it looks like I could learn how to post on here better. Sorry, not sure why half my post is colored.

Where thers is many mnay tabs for DAA & DAD, I did find a few last night for other tunings. I will print them out and start a collection and begin to try them out. If anyone can tell me if any of the tunings can use the same tabs as DAA or DAD besides DGD, that would be great. Otherwise, one step at a time - no worries, I am enjoying my journey in all things dulcimer.

Thank you again for all the decussions on here and all your help to me and many other members.

Somebody sells a pick tethered to a ring you wear.  Same concept as the baby's pacifier on a ribbon pinned to their onesy....You might drop it, but it won't go far!