Forum Activity for @patty-from-virginia

I'm looking forward to it Dana!

Patty My daughter videoed the whole concert but has to break it down into smaller parts so I can post it. I'll get her on the ball so I can post some. Also will post pics of the classes a friend of mine took pictures all day so there will be some.

John, it was a pleasure to meet you and get to visit a bit!

John WHY didn't you come up and tell me who you were I was so busy. Glad you had a good time.

I am jealous too. I hope someone will post some pictures and videos

Eric;

You can buy individual strings, just ask around, music stores, pawn shops [sometimes], and internet. All you need is the size [and end style if you need the little brass insert which can be removed if needed for loop ends].

John, it would be helpful to know specific songs you would like to play. Rocky Top and Foggy Mountain Breakdown are songs that you will not find in most dulcimer tab books. I play Rocky Top but in DAd tuning. There are several places on the Internet where one can find free dulcimer tab. Here is one place: http://everythingdulcimer.com/tab/index.php#R

Ken

The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Sandra, I hate to say this, but I am lost trying to figure out what it is you are wanting to know. If no one responds, call up McSpadden or email them your question and they will be able to answer it.

I just got notice my tab submission at Everything Dulcimer has been accepted. You'll find it under "M" as "My Clinch Mountain Home."

Hope this version works for you, Mary.

I'm assuming you want it for noter/drone playing, anyway I tabbed just the melody line. It's in an administrator's hands now at Everything Dulcimer. Don't know when or if it will be posted.

Ivan

I have the church-style. When I was trying to decide, Mike Clemmer strongly suggested the church-style. He said it would give more volume and sustain than the regular model. He said he mostly makes the church-style. GIven their size, you lose volume, so I'd suggest getting the most you can with the church-style. The added depth for travel is not an issue. I wouldn't even consider the regular model. I went with sassafras/walnut. It has a great tone and sustain. Fun to play.

I have a Sweetie with the church body. Frankly it's a2 inch deep body - which doesn't make it that biggeroverall size wise.I believe the church body is the standard make - so why go for the shallower modelif the builder ispreferring to make the church body? Go for it, a little extra resonance never hurt.

A simple way to add a little harmony here and there when playing the melody is to find on the middle string a harmonising note - it's usually the adjacent fret plus one over and play it at the same time as the melody.

So.. if your 4th finger was on the melody string, then your index finger would hop over to the middle string and be diagonal to the melody string fret with a gap of 1 fret inbetween.It's a clumsy explanation but if you try it you'll know immediately if it's wrong or right. I think this note on the middle string is the 3rd above whatever you're playing on the melody. Or the 5th? I've never gotten technical about it.

What the other posts were getting at was substituting chords which can sound very interesting (as long as you know what you're doing! lol) One easy way to approach it might be to substitute a minor chord for a major chord occasionally - at the end of a section for eg.

Which reminds me, the friends I play with are now doing You Are My Sunshine. It was decided to play the verses in minor keys and keep the chorus in the major keys. Definitely a different slant on the song! But you know the lyrics are a little on the dark side...

Yeah for some reason I can do it much easier on my banjo. That's my primary instrument and I can pretty much find anything I need on it without a problem. Just wanting to do the same on dulcimer and I'm probably just getting in my own way about it. Thanks for all the responses.

Just a thought...

Once there was melody and harmony. Chords (grips) and chord names came later.

In my first band back in the 1960tiesthe leadsinger played the guitar. He used very unusual chords. They sounded wonderfull. He didn't know what name they had. I had to tell him whenwritting the song down. He heard what the harmony had to be and usrd trial-and-errorto found out the grip. Yep, he was very, very musical.

You can do the same playing simple songs on the dulcimer. Play the melody and search for the spots where a chord must be played. Play the melody note and try to find on the other two strings which two notes sound the best together with it.

In this way you will learn not knowing to understand music, but hearing to understand music.

Music theory is not music itself: it is just a way to talk (and think) about music inthat way others who speak the same musical language will understand it. Music theory is frozen music practice. When something sounds good it is good and the theory will follow much later

Ok yes I get it John, thanks so much.

What a minute! your playing a G and D chord when your instrument is tuned to D A D, that's in the key of D. D is you're lead key

So the chords are D Em F# G A Bm

We need to do that stuff in perspective to the D chord and not the G. See if you can do it by yourself from my comment earlier about the key of G

The notes in the key of D are

D E F# G A B C# D

G was this

G A B C D E F# G

Mandy said:

Hey John, yes that makes perfect sense. I mostly play in DAD so I'd be G on 3rd fret. Thanks. So for the G chord since G B and D make up the chord those make sense. But what I don't get is how the A and the E work. How do I find out these notes using other chords without knowing theory? Hope that made sense to you?

It would help if we had a video room where we could share, but here goes.

All the notes in a scale work well with chords that are made up from that scale. Some notes work better than others. for example with a G chord, the notes of that chord are a solid and strong fit. With the A and the D notes, if you can imagine the black keys on a piano and when you play them randomly it all sounds kind of nice. Those notes make up what's called a pentatonic scale (5 note scale) that used in blues, rock, folk, country and many times without the artist even realizing it, they just sound kind of nice.

the reason, technically that they work well is a little more complex but it comes from the way youu can make a major chord with them. A G, when you add an E to it is called a G6 chord, A G when you add a A to it (preferably note right next to the G but higher up) is called a G major 9 chord.

When Skip mentioned that the F# is nice, he was really right. When you add a F# to a G chord you get G major 7. So those notes give our G chord a different name by adding them to each of them. From a 3 note chord, we now have 4 note chords, a little thicker and a little more harmonically involved.

Let's see, the A is one up from the G so that's there and the E is 2 down or 6 up from the G.

The numbering system is pretty straight forward, you probably know most if it already.

1--2--3--4--5--6---7----8 The boldunderlined are the notes that make up triads and 7ths.

D--E-F#-G--A--B--C#---DTheboldare the notes in the chord.

I-- ii-iii-IV--V--vi-vii0-octave, the bold are the major chords, italics is a dim.

Hey John, yes that makes perfect sense. I mostly play in DAD so I'd be G on 3rd fret. Thanks. So for the G chord since G B and D make up the chord those make sense. But what I don't get is how the A and the E work. How do I find out these notes using other chords without knowing theory? Hope that made sense to you?

Hi Mandy,

If I understand your inquiry about the chords that naturally work well (meaning the harmony chords first) with G and D. I think you're looking for this. If we go up one at a time from G, the chords would be

G Am Bm C D Em and a funny chord that I would leave out for now

So if you have a G, the notes in that G chord are G, B and D

The notes in the D chord are D, F# and A

Now if your playing the G chord or the D chord you could use any note in that G scale (depending if your G is an open string or on the 3rd fret of your dulcimer). But some work better than others. With the G chord, for example G, A, B, D, E notes work really well and the others C and F (if your G is an open string) ,or F# (if your G is on the 3rd fret)work good but mostly in passing.If your G is open, you may want to be careful with that F, it may not work.

For the D chord, we're still in thekey of G so for D, the notes that work really well are D, E, F#, A and B.

You're right to ask about the harmony and harmonic relation so I'm sure that you'll find your way by........playing!!

Maybe this is a bit convoluted but I hope this helps you out.

Yeah totally lost on all that. Yeah I knew I was getting in over my head with that question. I just don't know theory so I just try things out.

Are you familiar with naming chords by Roman numbers, eg., I chord, ii chord, etc.? If you are, try using the ii and/or vi chords [MOOC info]. ii chord in D is based on the E [EGB, (Eminor)], vi chord is based on B [BDF# (Bminor)]. In G, ii is based on A [ACE, (minor)] and vi is based on E. I don't remember exactly how they're used, as replacements for the IV/V chords or in line with them. You could also try using the dom 7ths, the basic 3 note triad plus the flatted 7th, in place of the major chord, for 3 strings try dropping the 5th [last note] of the triad, eg., D=DF#A; D7 = DF#AC; 3 stringer = DF#C. You could also try dropping the 3rd instead of the 5th, eg., DAC. Major 7ths may work, basic triad plus 7th, eg., DFAC#.

This is all stuff I just learned so I don't really know how well it will work.

From what I learned in the recent MOOC, chords are, essentially, harmony, if that helps.

Ok so I'm wanting to branch out in my playing more. Anyone have suggestions on how to find the harmony notes and chords without getting in too deep in the music theory department? Really looking to play more back up and variations within what I'm already doing to add in more instruments. I can do the basic stuff (play the same chords further up the neck, play the melody notes on the bass string kind of stuff) but am looking to expand more. Thanks. I could be just digging myself into a hole with this question but I'm living on the edge anyway so why not. LOL.

As an example let's say the main chords the song uses are G and D. What would be considered the harmony notes/chords of those 2 chords?

Hi Dusty,

thank you for your reply.

1.) In fact, when I first found this song in the internet, it was written in 3/8 time. Now I have also found the song in a song-book in 6/8 time. I don't know how Hannikainen wrote it. But both measures make sense, because the stress should be on the first eighth note of a group of three. 3/8|oo|oo|oo|oo|... resp. 6/8|oo oo|oo oo|...

If I'd put the 6 eighth notes into a 3/4 measure, I'd get 3 quarter notes resp. 3 groups of 2 eighth notes rather than 2 groups of 3 eight notes. 3/4|OO|OO|... resp. 3/4|o oo oo|o oo oo|

So I think, a 3/8 or 6/8 does make sense and gives the song the touch of a dance...

2.) Not at all - you are welcome to use it! Thank you for asking... Enjoy!

Thanks, Peter. That's a pretty tune.

I have two questions for you:

1) Why did you tab this in 3/8 time instead of 3/4 time? Were you just following the original score or is there some advantage to that time signature?

2) Would you mind if I shared this tab with my local dulcimer group in California? I think it would work as a nice study in basic chord shapes.

After focussing on the Finnish kantele for some time, I decided to tab a dulcimer version of a Finnish song today. The song is about a squirrel nest (drey) in the trees and about the baby squirrels' life while growing up in summer and winter, protected by their comfortable nest.

The music was written by Pekka Juhani Hannikainen (1854-1924), so according to European laws it is in the public domain (author died more than 70 years ago).

As some notes of the melody are on the second string (A) in DAdd tuning, I recommend to play it in flat picking or fingerpicking style.

Enjoy. :)

I'll try to record it by the end of this week.

EDIT: So here's the recording:

I've used this kind of non-slip carpet pad. I also use it on my workbench. Same advice as above about storage

The rubber shelf liner material only damages the finish if you store it against the dulcimer....like folded under the dulcimer in its case, or leaning the dulcimer against the shelf liner on its stand. Using it for regular playing times does no harm. Just keep them away from each other while not in use.

John- good point about the thighs being level.

The first thing you need to do to stop sliding, is stop wearing "slippery" pants made from polyester blends. I get very little sliding from cargo pants, chinos or denim jeans.

Second thing is proper position and posture - sit up straight, knees wide apart, 1st fret over your left knee, dulcimer angled back to your right hip not square across your legs, thighs parallel to the floor (use a foot rest, special chair or other aid if necessary).

Third, use the little finger of your right hand to continuously pull the instrument back in place about every third strum.

I agree with John about the shelf liner. It's good stuff, if you can't manage good position and posture. Just don't leave it under your dulcimer, in the case, for days/weeks/months in the summer!

I think the danger of a shelf liner to a finish is over-stated. If I used one and discovered it had a tendency to stick firmly to the instrument after a short time, then I would worry. Otherwise I wouldn't concern myself. The finish surface (matte vs gloss) isn't the issue so much as what the finish and/or liner were made from. I wouldn't store them touching, though.

I discovered that if I use a chair or stool low enough my feet are flat and my thighs are parallel to the floor, slipping isn't an issue.

I find the 'under the thighs' strap system is much firmer than the 'round the back' system for contemporary playing styles (chords and out-strum lead) - it also allows for more 'aggressive' positioning and strumming. For traditional playing technique (noter and in-strum lead or thumb strum) the dulcimer sliding around is not so much of a problem. Many of the old dulcimers I have are quite rough on the back andtwo small pieces of shelf liner or chamois leather sorts out those that are a bit slippery.

Hmm....well, I generally have a big bulky brace on my left knee. That seems to stop the dulcimer from sliding pretty well!

I just use a strap. I find that if I angle it out and down a bit at the top (I lower my left knee a bit) and have the strap taut that it has nowhere to go and doesn't slide. I play pretty aggressively sometimes, and never have any problem. Seems to be some good ideas from others here, so I hope you figure something out.

I have been using some of the shelf liner type material to hold my dulcimer in place. However, I just had strap buttons put on 2 of my dulcimers and use a strap under my legs instead of around the back. The strap I ordered was actually too big, so I took it to a shoe shop and they are adjusting it for me. I like this by far better than anything I've tried. My teacher suggested using the strap this way - if you have it tight enough under your legs, the dulcimer doesn't slide or wobble at all. Too bad it's taken me 2 years to figure this out!

I use a strap and that works fine. I play pretty aggressively too so if I don't use a strap it would be in the floor in pieces! Good luck!