Forum Activity for @ken-longfield

I'm coming in late to this discussion Linda, but let me add a thought or two. First, I think the tuners are banjo friction tuners ( probably Champion) and the plastic buttons were replaced by walnut buttons. I don't know if this was done by the manufacturer (Grover) or by McSpadden. Second, wood is subject to changes in humidity and temperature. After taking the dulcimer out of the closet, there may have been some swelling or shrinking of the wood in the peg head. Sometimes when the screw bottoms out another washer, which is thicker than the original, can be used to thicken the side wall of the peg head allowing more space for the screw to tighten. There really isn't anything to malfunction on those pegs as they are a friction fit, but unlike violin pegs where the friction is within the peg hole, the friction on these pegs is against the wall of the peg head.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Dear Richard, thank you, thank you! Your suggestion is much appreciated because I finally got the courage to take it apart--your advice to take note of the washer order saved me. As it turns out, they have two metal washers sandwiched between a plastic ring.  By taking them apart, and putting them back together, for some mysterious reason they then worked. I've attached a photo of the innards. I'm very grateful to you! Linda

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Hiya again, Wally, see the response I just wrote. Merci, Linda

Dear Wally, and you are a dear!  I am amazed by all the learning I have gotten from your email and those of others who have replied.  I never dreamed I would have the courage to take apart the tuners on a musical instrument because, in the past, I have had a 98% failure rate on putting things together that I have taken apart.   I didn't even have the language to describe those pegs because I knew they weren't the violin friction type, nor the geared type. So, thank you. As it turns out, they have two metal washers sandwiched between a plastic ring.  By taking them apart, and putting them back together, voila, now they work--not sure why except maybe the dulcimer was happier that someone was paying attention to it. So again, many thanks. Linda

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You asked "what type of tuner?" I just looked at your photo, and you tuners are interesting in their own right due to the way the wood is held between metal fingers. I can't find any match on the Elderly Instrument tuners web page, and there are a lot of designs there.
https://www.elderly.com/pages/search-results?offset=456&q=tuners

Friction pegs (non-violin type) are common on banjos and ukuleles. Looking at the following web pages I identified about five basic types. Some use fiber washers while others use plastic. Yours appear to be fiber since some are more compressed than others.

All About Ukulele Friction Tuners - Got A Ukulele Beginners Tips

Banjo Tuner Tips & Tricks

Some really old high quality instruments used tapered tuning pegs, apparently designed to fit in the holes used for violin pegs. A video dealing with these is:
1920’s Martin Ukulele- What to do about the friction pegs?

One of the videos mentions screws bottoming out. That might be your problem if the wood has shrunk over the past 40 years. That could explain the left-right difference.

It sounds like you have a solid plan for maintaining and improving your dulcimer! Using peg dope for lubrication and Murphy's Oil Soap for cleaning are great practices to keep your instrument in good condition. Sanding out scratches and refinishing areas as needed can also help restore its appearance. Best wishes with your project, and I hope your dulcimer continues to bring you joy and beautiful music!

1 week from today is International Appalachian Dulcimer Day!    

Feel free to share any work you create (music, photography, embroidery, jewelry, poetry, etc.) which celebrates the Appalachian dulcimer and its spread around the world!  

Richard said " If you ever disassemble one all the way take note of the order of the metal and the fiber washers on the shaft."

Perhaps at some time in the past someone took one or more of them apart and incorrectly reassembled them. If one is better than another, you might have a model to check against.

There is a small fiber washer in the mechanism if my memory is still good. Sometimes that can be the culprit. I have had some success loosening them a lot and then slowly tightening them back down. If you ever disassemble one all the way take note of the order of the metal and the fiber washers on the shaft. Sometimes just using them will get them holding again. After all no exercise for 40 + years and we all forget how to do things.

Hi Ken, Thank you so much for the tip. That was the first thing I tried, and they were a little loose, but now the pegs on the right keep slipping. I appreciate the thought, though!

Yes

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

 I'll take note of that, you are very fortunate that you have a group session that caters to both newbie and advance players.

Making progress! For clarification @ken-longfield, to set up the action, you put the dime on the fret board, and the nickel on top of the fret?

Those tuners should have a tiny screw in the end of each knob, which adjust how 'firmly' they stay in tune.  Start with a 1/4 turn tighter and see how that works.  Need more turn a little more...  Too tight and they won't adjust.

Greetings!  A friend recently gave me a 1979 McSpadden dulcimer that has been sitting in her closet since 1980, and she is moving so didn't want to take it with her. It's signed by Larry McSpadden! The first couple of days I couldn't get it to stay in tune; one of the tuning pegs kept slipping; I finally got it to stay in CGC, much to my surprise and lots of tries. Then, after playing it a day or two I got it to DAD.  I am ASTONISHED at the resonance and sustain on this instrument, not to mention the drone. Just amazing!  So, I cleaned it up and restrung it, and now both pegs on the left keep slipping. 

Does anyone know what kind of tuners these are and if they are fixable? The two on the right still grab, but neither on the left. Thank you for any suggestions.

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The Pocono Dulcimer Festival now has my workshop listed: Workshop descriptions, pg 4: "Laparoscopic Crack Repair"

Here is the registration and schedule page

She will be missed . I sold literally hundreds of her book Larkin's Dulcimer Book which I still consider the best dulcimer primer out there. I used to include a copy with my dulcimers . Lovely woman.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1_xP2QDs

 Sounds good!  Do you have the youtube link you can share?

I just discovered this on youtube, and thought others might enjoy it.  It's a scratchy old record, but the authenticity and simplicity make it truly wonderful.

Would be great to see you there, Ken.  I can't remember whether we've met before.

And Marg, thanks so much for mentioning the workshop and letting me know a player is interested in it. I was raised in East Texas, and always glad to see a Texan.

I talked about how we should handle our dulcimers in class (that you mention Dwain) & your workshop. We are just  north of Houston and it seems one of our players was planning on going to the Pocono Festival and will look for when your workshop is posted to registrar. 

Thanks, that will be great

marg.

I like the sound of the wound bass drone with the doubled high drones a lot!

I seldom go to festivals anymore for workshops but just to visit with dulcimer friends. However, Dwain, your workshop interests me. I might register for the Pocono festival just for that. I can easily drive over, take your workshop, and return home. I'll see when it is scheduled to take place. Thanks for offering this.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

(a workshop for builders and repairers on how to fix )

this would be so helpful, wish I was closer. What a good idea, I have often thought of using an older (with problems) dulcimer to demonstrate a few things, to the newer players.

In the Appalachian wilderness, pioneers baptized a new instrument, derived from alpine zithers and known as the "dulcimer." Acceptable to the Church unlike the violin, it accompanied hymns, its name found in the Bible, making it ideal for religious music in the region.

By the way, at the upcoming Pocono Club Dulcimer Festival in Stroudsburg, PA (April 27, 27) I will be teaching a workshop for builders and repairers on how to fix cracks anywhere inside musical instruments, including aligning the two sides of the crackand cleaning the inside surface across the crack in preparation for glueing an interior reinforcing cross cleat.

All this is done from outside the inside the instrument! I pass all interior materials though the nearest soundhole, and clamp the crack with interior/exterior matching magnets, and clamp the cleat with a system of springs and stops. The workshop title is "Laparoscopic Crack Repair."I will be repairing a crack on an old dulcimer that was such a failure that I cut it in half to use for this sort of demonstration.

Attached is a photo of the interior cleat glued and clamped across the crack inside —all arranged with a thread passed through a small hole drilled into the crack and later repaired.

This workshop isn't on the website's schedule yet, as Norm Williams and I just talked about it last week. Builders, please spread the word!

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Good information Dwain, I think I will share this with my class tomorrow. 

Robin, double drone is very underrated in my opinion. I like the richness of the bass tone a lot. Some lute and baroque guitars as well as other older instruments have all strings doubled except the melody strings. This may have been for practical reasons (thinner strings were probably harder to make/more costly) but I do think it allows the melody strings to stand out more clearly from the drone.

Sometimes this sort of crack happens when the dulcimer is lifted or carried by grasping it by the top and back. The back is usually sturdier, but the top will crack at either its weakest wood grain or where the strain is greatest. The area where the top is glued to the fretboard is an area least able to respond by bending when the top is pressed by being lifted like this.

I see no reason here to suspect that was the cause, but builders regularly have to caution musicians to always lift the dulcimer by the peghead or tailblock (or strap) rather than putting the top and back into a vise-like grip between the thumb and fingers.

Similarly, trying to lift a mountain dulcimer by grasping the fretboard risks pressing fingernail dents into the top.

Welcome Rob! 

You're going to love your new McSpadden, a great choice!

We would love to see it a picture of it, after you get it.

Nice to have you here @robmachin ! 
McSpadden dulcimers tend to be very reliable and sound wonderful.
Be sure to join our UK Group on FOTMD as well.

Thank you again,

  All good & I took everyones advice and supported the sound hole, not just the one with the crack but I glued some wood under the overhangs in all the sound holes

  Yes, very glad to I was able to repair the crack and learn much, along the way. 

marg

 repaired crack.jpg - 370KB

Depending on string strike timing/forces used, it's all about the waveform spectrum and the phase interplay between the pitches & the harmonics produced from this. Even slightly out of phase components between the two will cancel slightly. Conversely in-phase will reinforce, the end effect is an altered sound spectrum which won't sound like 2 pure pitches played together. This the "fullness" that is heard but not louder.

Interestingly because wave prorogation/ pressure level is governed by the square root rule to make your Dulcimers twice sound as loud as all the others you'll need to strike the strings with 4 times the force of the others players.

I think slashed fingers/broken strings would be the order of day if you tried that

Some months ago, I was just messing around with string configurations.  Doubled melody vs. doubled drone vs. 4 equidistant.    It was cool to hear the differences.  

Welcome,@robmachin !  Enjoy your McSpadden when it's made its way to you!  

Hello everyone!

I just joined the group here at FOTMD, and thought I would say "hello". I'm totally new to Dulcimer, and about to start learning - have just ordered one from McSpadden.

I live in a small town in Buckinghamshire in England with my wife and two children, two dogs and three cats ... so I send you all greetings from there! :-)

Looking forward to taking part in the community here.

With all good wishes, Rob

Thanks all for the additional context and food for thought. My starting point was assuming that two melody strings are louder, because the fuller more pronounced tone has always made it seem louder. The first time I heard the thing about the two speakers next to each other, it was really un-intuitive to me.
The more I think about it, it makes sense to me that if two strings were tuned exactly the same, the effect of paired melody strings would be less noticeable, and the tone would not be noticeably fuller.
I also think the sympathetic resonance of the two strings off each other must help with sustain, which might feel like more volume, since the note retains its full volume for longer before fading.

Definitely sounds very mellow and guitar like. The shape looks very similar to the folkcraft resonator dulcimers. To my eye, it looks like they took the exact shape for the resonator dulcimer and installed a saddle rather than a cone. I personally like the tone and look of that style, though it's definitely a very modern look.

Marg, as a builder I am aware of such things.  If I make a dulcimer with intricate soundholes, I'll glue some tiny wood pieces under overhangs, at right angles to them, as has been discussed below.  It's just a good practice to get into and prevents breakages later.  Glad you were able to repair your own dulcimer!