Forum Activity for @wally-venable

>>> get an electronic tuner.

I agree, although many now like to use a cell phone APP.

>>> Use the tuner to verify that the frets are properly placed.

Yes, if the tuner shows every not is "in the green" you don't have problems with fret placement. Using your method, if the strings are high, a tuner will "tell you" that the frets are misplaced.

If you have a good ear, simply playing the octave fret will tell you a whole lot about intonation. The error may be either bad fretting or string height.

And we have not touched on "buzzing" which may also require correction.

@Tull66, Different strokes for different folks.

My first experience in my dulcimer world was to build a kit. No musical or wood working background or mentoring at all. It turned out good, I still have it. I went on to build some from scratch and to buy some, although none were [are] foreign made. Be aware there are poorly made MD's floating around in the US that are wallhangers also, but they are mostly homemade I think. I have a friend who bought a foreign made MD, It sounded ok to me, but he is very experienced and has made some stringed instruments. Actually, I've really never heard a bad sounding MD in 20+ years, cardboard or home built, lucky I suppose. If you decide to get an inexpensive or questionable sourced MD, be sure of the return policy and get an electronic tuner. Use the tuner to verify that the frets are properly placed. Folks here will help with that. A used name brand is an option also.

Bottom line, you started at the right place, here. You're getting getting input from several different viewpoints, from folks with different backgrounds and experience, all of which have merit. 

I would absolutely tell anyone with no dulcimer experience or first hand technical advisor NOT to buy a dulcimer kit from anyone.

If you don't really know what you are doing, shop in a face-to-face setting where you can try out the instrument and discuss it with the seller. Preferably the seller should demonstrate the instrument.

I suspect that the "unplayable" Applecreek dulcimers primarily need a proper setup. It is common in the music world for factory made instruments to be shipped with the expectation that the selling dealer will do a setup to meet the customer's needs. This is primarily adjusting string height, but also may involve other details. In the ukulele world, string heights are typically too high because lowering them is easy, but raising them isn't. This is probably true for most low priced fretted instruments. If you buy such an instrument, the retail dealer, not the manufacturer or wholesale distributor, is responsible for assuring that the instrument is ready for use.

Wooden instruments can, or will, change between the time they are built and the time the first owner begins to play them. Woods bend, and exposure to string tension can also alter them. No builder can predict the changes.

Generally speaking, if you are ordering an instrument costing $500 or so directly from a well established builder, it will probably be checked and setup before shipping. This is partly because the builder's reputation is at stake and partly because the builder is doing retail business.

For those with a good musical ear, I suspect that if the heights are just a bit high a dulcimer set up with (common) 0.012 strings and which plays "OK" in DAA tuning might be irritating if tuned to DAD, but OK in DAD if restrung with 0.010 melody strings. Correcting that sort of thing is "setup." My opinion on that is based on 70+ years of playing string instruments, training in physics, and amateur building of a variety of fretted instruments. It's not "Rocket Science," but it is precision technology.

I have seen dulcimers from semi-pro builders which were NOT properly set up. Knowing wood working isn't the same are knowing lutherie.

With regard to natural wood versus cardboard versus laminated construction, you should not generalize. All need setup, whether by the builder, retailer, or buyer.

Our local dulcimer group instructor bought a batch of cardboard dulcimers for loan to students. They have served us well for a decade or so, but this is because her guitar player husband spent hours doing the setup, as well as some assembly. She also purchased a group of Applecreek instruments, but again they got an adequate checkout.

... Or to be lent to a complete stranger with no experience who wants to explore playing music.

I have two lovely Jack Lyle dulcimers and one has a slit longer than the one in yours and the other has none. It is most likely an additional sound hole, perhaps is presence and/or size has to do with the woods used and whether or not it needed more volume?

There is a lot of good to be said for an instrument that is playable but cheap enough to not be afraid to haul it around to camping or travel situations where one would be extremely nervous to take one's more expensive instrument.

Ken that is wonderful news. Those folks are going to be sooooo happy to hear your live music again... so special for them!

@jost  said Well according to fotmd and the Facebook groups AppleCreek is something of a lottery. You can end up with a cheap and great sounding instrument but you have also a high chance of getting expensive firewood. I wouldn't risk my bucks for it.

Possibly a beginner might not know the difference, but @wally-venable shouldn't feel too put down.  We both won that lottery.  Found one in an antique store that was small enough for me to use as a "travel dulcimer" that both takes less space & isn't something I'd get upset if anything happened to it.  It's definitely not something I use in a program or even play at home since I have other dulcimers I like for other reasons, but I bought it & right afterwards started seeing all the bad press a while back.  If you buy it, either try it first in the store or make sure you know the return policy.

I've never tried a cardboard dulcimer, but not everybody wants to put together their instrument first. 

Glad you have this problem sorted out, @tull66 , just felt the AppleCreek discussion deserved another view.

I am happy to report that our group is back playing at a local retirement center. There are three sections to the center: assisted living, nursing home, and memory unit. We played this past Wednesday at the memory unit. Next month we will play for the nursing home residents and the month after that for the assisted living folks. We play the first Wednesday of every month and are scheduled through the end of the year. Protocols require that we check in at the main desk, have our temperatures taken, receive a visitors badge, and then can proceed to where we play. Masks are required while walking through the buildings, but not while performing.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Interesting point about feedback. I only use it when I play in a group. our club leader has the amplification, I will try to use it one day when it is just me, also I will call Myers support. Thanks for your suggestions, I really want it to work.

Visiting nursing homes is challenging at any time, and even more so during a pandemic.

Thanks!  @theresasc

I have a couple more dulcimers since I last posted! 

I have a Cripple Creek "Aspen Leaf," which is shaped rather like a Galax dulcimer--more of an oval than a teardrop.  Came from eBay and needed some work to get it playable.  But I love the leaves-and-vines soundholes, and it sounds good now. 

And, a no-name dulcimer, also from eBay, all mahogany, built by a shipwright. 

I previously forgot to mention that I have two "travel size" dulcimers, one from the Dulcimer Factory and one by Rugg and Jackel. 

Most of mine are diatonic, and I'm thinking of having the 6+ fret added to a couple of them. 

Thank you Richard.

Cardboard dulcimers sound much better than one would expect.  I sometimes wonder why I build from wood when cardboard sounds so wonderful.

I wonder why the myers pickup didn't work for you. Which model did you try?

I'm quite happy with mine ( great sound and working on my other instruments too):

https://www.myerspickups.com/products/the-grip-flexible-micro-gooseneck

One reason I can imagine : They are real microphones thus feedback might be a problem in some cases ( e.g. in a  band or group setting). In the open mic at the local pub  I frequent I didn't had any issues up to now. I play solo though.

Did you try to contact their support for help or a refund? 

I didn't  need it up to now but read only good things about it.

Well according to fotmd and the Facebook groups AppleCreek is something of a lottery. You can end up with a cheap and great sounding instrument but you have also a high chance of getting expensive firewood. I wouldn't risk my bucks for it.

So I would also suggest a kit by Folkcraft or some other renowed builder.

If I would be living in the USA a cardboard md would have been my first Instrument.

The shipping costs to Germany were to expensive so I ended up with an nice instrument by a local builder.

Just my two Cents, your mileage may vary

That has not been my experience.

While I respect everyone's opinion, I hate to see a beginner led down the wrong path and possibly give up learning the dulcimer because of a low quality starter instrument. Apple Creek is probably the only brand that is nearly universally condemned as low quality and inconsistent. In fact, I've seen many that are flat out un-playable.
In my humble opinion, you are better off with a cardboard dulcimer or a lower cost dulcimer from a reputable builder.

At the moment, I have 8 mountain dulcimers here in the house and soon the number will be 7.  (My oldest niece is interested in mountain dulcimer and I will be giving one to her when life allows.)  Over the past year or so, I've passed several instruments along to a couple young people and hope they enjoy them for a long time!

In addition, I have 3 Ken Bloom bowed dulcimers and one Michael Fox Dulcijo.   

I have two mountain dulcimers:
A cherry Galax by Ben Seymour, and a curly maple teardrop by Keith Young.
- I also have an old factory/kit dulcimer that someone gave me years ago, but I don't find it easy to play so I only use it for beginner video demos, since it does not have a visually distracting 1.5 fret.

I also have four 'dulcimer ancestor' type instruments: two epinettes, a hummel, and a langspil.

Probably a bit of a shocker for some, but at the moment, I only own...one! A walnut teardrop and the second dulcimer I’ve built (same one in my profile pic). 

I have added a dulcimer since last year. I own three McSpadden dulcimers and one Black Mountain dulcimer. My latest is a Ginger McSpadden dulcimer made of redwood and black walnut with an ebony fretboard. It belonged to the late Jan Schultz. I bought it a month ago. It has a deep, round tone. For a small dulcimer, it a surprisingly loud. If I had to have only one dulcimer, this would be the one.

thanks for your response.  My Dulcimer has a flat strum hollow. I think I will go to a Music store and try a Seymour Duncan pick up. I bought a Myers pick up online, and it has never worked well for me to amplify. I hate to buy another item without trying it.

Joe, it is wonderful to hear that Joe Sanguinette started you on your dulcimer journey. He was a very nice gentleman and good builder. I hope you are enjoying and playing all of those "revival" dulcimers. My profile of Joe appeared in DPN Volume 23, No. 3 in 1997.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

I am beginning to feel like a bit of a hoarder as I’m reading about everyone’s collections! At last count, I have 57 dulcimers in my collection, mostly vintage 60’s, 70’s & 80’s. Though I haven’t counted them since my last move five years ago, so I’m guessing it’s more in the mid to upper 60’s for count now. I’ve been collecting since 1981 after meeting and and purchasing my very first dulcimer from Joe Sanguinette. Little did Joe know what a crazy odyssey of a love affair that little 15 year old boy who shared his first name would go on to have with dulcimers…all because of him!

Ron

I have a Boss GT-1 Guitar effects processor I make my own sounds with, I am not sure what or how many effects went into the humming tone of the lullaby. I try and create the sound that would go with the music & tone I am after, for the lullaby I was after something that sounded like rocking the baby at 3:00 in the morning

CajunJam

If the other's amp has more then one connection you could, maybe but what ever setting they have it set to, would also be the setting you would be using.

I didn't buy a floating pickup, I made it myself. If you notice the photos of the 2 dulcimers with the pickups you can better see what I am describing. Also, notice in the lullaby iI am playing a different dulcimer, that's because you can make the floating pickup to go on top of several of your dulcimers.

Yes, a humbucking (a little taller) or Seymour Duncan (a little thinner) would work, you just need to place either pickup on 2 little post that fits on the sides of your fretboard and tall enough the strings are not bothered. I am using 2 small wooden screw blocks from the kids wooden construction set & just some mounting putty to hold it all together for my floating pickup.

I do have a dulcimer that has a flat strum hollow and the Seymour Duncan just slides under the strings - but most dulcimers don't have a flat area. That's when I came up with the idea of above the strings. these pickups are great, they read the strings not the vibration of the sound board, so you get a better tone & more responsive. 

I hope this helps

m.

Nice to see I'm not the only one adding to their collection. Thanks for sharing.

Updated since last year:

Jacob Gross fretted zither -- replica of one in the Mercer Museum
Large Burnsville NC holly leaf
Small Burnsville NC holly leaf
Til Holloway hourglass  -- out on loan
Harry Wicker KY hourglass
Ozark Walking Stick coffin shape
Korean Honda hourglass -- out on loan
John Knopf JE Thomas replica hourglass 
Bobby Ratliff Hogfiddle elliptical
Bobby Ratliff Cumberland Travel model elliptical 
2 Anglo-Saxon Lyres
1 laptop Cajon Box Drum
4 Mirliton flutes
2 Pennywhistles

I just looked at the previous post in this discussion. I need to update my list and add a violin my wife found in a closet when doing spring cleaning. Neither one of us remembers where it came from. Also, I now have three more dulcimers and an Oscar Schmidt autoharp. I also discovered a recorder, tin whistle, and Native American flute. There are probably still more for me to find in closest and cabinets.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

As of right now, I do not have any mountain dulcimers but I have one on order and one kit that needs to be built.

Ron Gibson cherry - on order

Hughes walnut kit - to be built

I do have other stringed instruments:

3 concert ukulele

1 tenor ukulele

a Seagull Merlin stick dulcimer

a McNally strum stick

and for fun, a couple of kazoo's

I do not want to even try to count how many weaving looms I have, so I understand acquisition diseases quite well.  At first I was surprised when all of the sudden I had 4 ukulele, but I should have known it would happen🤣

Congrats on  your new dulcimer. I know you are excited.

Dulcimer Acquisition Disease.

I ordered #7 today. I've been contemplating this one for quite a while. My husband said "life can through you a curve ball at any time....just do it". So I got my order in. A 4 month wait begins.

(Hickory sweetness, with some secial features.)

I usually play acoustic. But occasionally our club will play in a large room like a nursing home. Most of the others have built-in pick ups. Would a humbucking Or Seymour Duncan allow me to plug into the amp that the others are using. Can I buy it as a floating pickup?  Thanks

If the cardboard dulcimer kits were less than $50, I'd support the suggestion that they are a good first instrument. My wife started on a borrowed one.

Given price realities, I'd strongly recommend the small Applecreek dulcimer. Musician's Friend sells it for about $90 including shipping.It is also available elsewhere, including local music stores, for about $130.

https://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-traditional-instruments/apple-creek-dulcimer/510985000000000?cntry=US&cur=USD&utm_content=510985000000000--Apple+Creek+Dulcimer&source=3WWRWXGS&gclid=Cj0KCQjw-daUBhCIARIsALbkjSYEltKaS7Fs8hL-W8oj-b52fwkpBeVI-o4TqblScoCbR7xYsnzMqiMaAlBiEALw_wcB

It has a nice sound. It's built in an ISO 9001 certified musical instrument factory in Romania from the same woods that the company uses to produce violins, guitars, etc.

Thank you both for your help!  I am in the process of ordering a dulcimer from a builder in Bradford, PA.  I just couldn’t pull the trigger on a cardboard one. 

@tull66 , Ken H has answered your original question below.

I'd like to point out a place that will answer many of your questions as to how to post in a forum, how to add photos, etc:
https://fotmd.com/forums/forum/site-questions-how-do-i

Note- that forum i linked to is not a place to ask your dulcimer questions, but if you browse the threads there you'll see answers to many of your questions on how to navigate this site.

Welcome!