Forum Activity for @nate

I saw a Stephen Seifert video where he showed a dulcimer made for him that had a strumhollow which went all the way up to the 14th fret (16th literally) and he explained it was made this way because that was where he preferred to strum. I have attached an image. What do y'all think of the idea of hollowing out one of the spaces between two of the frets low down the fretboard? For example, if there was a strumhollow between the 8th and 9th frets, another between the 12th and 13th and another just past the bottom frets? Then while playing the top of the fretboard you could use the top strumhollow, while playing the middle you could use the middle strumhollow, and when playing way down the frets you can use the traditional strumhollow. Maybe this would be structurally weak or ugly, but I would expect that it would be more practical for consistent sound quality with less effort and technique and also would maybe reduce the damage over time caused from the pick hitting the fretboard.

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Irene -  to play with a pick and not get flap, you have to slide the pic across the strings at an angle in each direction, not hold the pick rigidly vertical at right angles to the plane of the strings.  On the outstroke the angle is like this / but a shallower angle.  On the instroke the angle is opposite \ again again even more shallow.  if you keep the pick vertical | you get a distinct 'click' as the pick releases each string in turn.  But if you angle the pick it just slides from string to string.  The trick is learning to turn the wrist and forearm as you strum.   That's how I learned from Robert Force anyway...

Thanks Lois.   Well, I can see folks playing here and on youtube....playing on the 12 fret or there abouts....with using their hand and not a pick, then the sweet tone is there for sure.  I watch Kendra Ward play, always in the strum hollow....she uses a corset stay.....that would make a quick mess of fret boards up higher.  I can also see that's it's  a bit hard when it's on the lap.....so the flappty flap flap is copied.  Tell me how you can play with a pick and NOT get that flappy flap flap?  It's great percussion, but I don't want percussion on all my music with the dulcimore.   As others have said many times here, there's no right or wrong way to play a dulcimore....there's just  the joy of playing music alone or with others.  So thank you other lutherers out there that made a strum hollow....I use 'em.  aloha, irene

At the risk of leaving the point of the discussion, since the strum hollow seems a bit of protection from picks . . .

Tend to agree, @Irene.  Picks cramp your hand and, unless I specifically want the percussion, I, too, am no fan of the FLAP FLAPITY FLAP.  As to where to play, I probably need to pay more attention.  I remember being surprised when my husband asked why I didn't use the strum hollow.  Never noticed.  Had more important things to pay attention to and now this discussion's got me noticing a bit more.

I thought the same when I first tried it Don, but since then I've made perhaps 50 dulcimers using this method and it works perfectly. I wouldn't want to try it on softwood though. This is what it looks like with the strings in place.

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Grateful for the place to order the brass pins, thanks John.  and a beautiful job of how to hide the ball end of a string.   There are a lot of ways of tying those strings down.....but a stick out with all of 'em attached to one is not a good solution.   aloha, irene

I add a strum hollow on all the dulcimers I build. I assume my customers expect it. And it looks cool. But do you need one? I would say no. Personally I never play over the hollow. Usually it's over the twelfth to sixteenth fret area. But I can see it's usefulness with finger picking. Metal finger picks especially.... Robert.

I would think that eventually the hole will elongate from the tension of the sting pulling the ball end into the wood. The pin holds the ball end in place away from the wood. However I am not a luthier...

Very neat workaround. Definitely an aesthetically nice solution

Have been practicing on Ashokan Farewell trying to get fluid on it. Very fond of Dusty's performance and have watched it a few times for study!

Favorite Dulcimer to play right now is my 30" long dulcimer. Keep it between us, but i never bothered to finish trimming the frets down

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That's an interesting design, Clive.  Wouldn't work for every design, certainly, but if it works for you, that's what matters.  

My belief is that strum hollows are not necessary.  I think many new builders (in the 60's and 70's) followed the Kentucky tradition of Ed Thomas.  They saw many photos of these dulcimers, to the exclusion of older Virginia dulcimers, and just thought that was "the way they were supposed to be built".  I certainly didn't see any examples back then of dulcimers without strum hollows.

Rob, I had a Hughes dulcimer from the 80's, and it did have a strumhollow...and, I lived in Colorado at the time ...I don't know about any of their dulcimers  before that.

When I got my 1st dulcimer nearly 40 years ago I thought you should play over the strum hollow most of the time.  I learned quickly that sul tasto (toward the nut) and sul ponticello (toward the bridge) would do the same as on the guitar: a sweeter sound toward the nut, a more metallic sound near the bridge.  Like others I used them to vary the sound as I did on the guitar.  However, you can do the same thing without a strum hollow.  Here's a pic of my Heatherwood, which has no strum hollow:

I believe the Hughes dulcimers were made the same way.  Maybe that was a Colorado thing? 

That being said, you can see by some old dulcimers without strum hollows people wore down the part of the fretboard over which they were strumming.  My problem is not that but wearing the top from vigorous strumming and fingerpicking.  My Rockwell is going to look like Willie's Trigger in about a year if I don't watch it.  LOL.

I got so fed up with pins that I decided to try something else. I drill 4 shallow holes big enough to hold the ball end and cut 4 slots between them and the bridge. It makes changing strings easier and makes the sound better, on my dulcimers at least, perhaps because it is attached to wood and not metal.

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yep, Steven, I'm with you on that.   However, during this Plandemic, I've loved the hymns most of all and Tomasi, my husband, playing the autoharp with me.   There's one I've been working on...........COME HOME.  although I'm already muchly at home............I love playing my newest dulcimer that is all cherry wood and I'd sent the peg head to a carving son that lives in Maui, he carved a beautiful scroll head for me and this is a bright sounding dulcimer.  Still, I love my big Box dulcimer that is so very mellow.....aloha, irene

WOW, another interesting and thoughtful post.   yep, I've tried several kinds of finish.   On my harps and other instruments I've used OLD DAD'S wipe on finish and I loved that.   Easy to put on, to touch up and all.  then they went out of business.  I then went to General Finishes (Oil based) Gel Topcoat Satin.   I also noticed that too many coats seemed to lessen the sound.   So 3 is about my limit and very thin coats.  My brother introduced to some water based finish that dried in an hour........and I didn't like it all....but it was a trial on the one that I had with me there.   I'm going to sand that one down and try something else.   When in Hawaii in the month of Feb.....I made two dulcimers and got what Bob suggested Minwax wipe on Poly.   I like that very much.....3 thin coats is all that is necessary.   Who was it in Berea that said they often didn't have any varnish or paint on the early ones?   and it's very very true, all of these instruments need time to develop their sound.....the little tiny air pockets need to be filled with sound and sing.   There has been studies on instruments that ARE NOT PLAYED and they do lose their musicality.  It's so fun to play an instrument, and have the other instruments I have around me do some sounding simpathetically. aloha, irene

Well, now, I must say something here.   Being that I had NO ONE to teach me in Hawaii 35+ years ago, I learned from Jean Richie's books.   Then when I met some wonderful folks in Southern Oregon 20 years ago.....they played all over like you talk about here.   Weird for me....I didn't like the FLAP FLAPITY FLAP with the picks on the fret board. I really LIKE playing at the strum hole.   HOWEVER, I've also watched so many videos on this site and those that play without picks and with chording..............finger dancing all the way.....I love the sound as well.   It's that FLAP FLAPTIY FLAP....and maybe only for me.............distracts from the beautiful melodies and or chords folks use when they play.  Yes, Ken, there is a sweet sound in the middle....but I often play way up high on the fret board....so for me............I stick to playing at the strum hollow.   aloha, irene

My favorite dulcimer and tune are the ones I'm playing at the time I'm playing.

"Is the strumhollow redundant?"....Yes...and no.  About the only reason for having one may be to provide an area on the fretboard to protect it from the wear caused by the plectrum or quill hitting it during play. 

You bet it is, Robin!

IMHO, yes, the strumhollow is unnecessary.  Yes, the ideal place to strum is half way between where the string is fretted and the bridge -- which of course changes constantly as you play.  Most players strum somewhere around fret 12-14, some up as far as fret 8.    I strum in different places depending on the effect I am trying to achieve -- from brash down around the bridge to mellow at the half-way point of the vibrating string. 

Hollowing the fretboard for its entire length will definitely remove more wood than carving a strum hollow, especially with the wide modern fretboards.  Rather than a strum hollow, I prefer to simply round-over the edges of the fretboard between the last fret and the bridge.

The fretboard holes on that diatonic stick aren't so much for reducing weight as they are for adding more sound-hole to the construction.  Some dulcimer builders, following older traditional instrument designs, drill one or two 1/2" or 5/8" holes through the fretboard (hollowed or no) all the way into the soundbox.

Not really needed. I make my staple boards with them on the Kentucky pieces because the old masters did. Like Bobby said, we strum about staple 14, a few inches beyond the hollow.

I have no use for strum hollows. I build traditional Virginia dulcimores and they didn't have them is one reason. The other reason is I never strum there so there's no sense in going through the extra work to add one if I don't strum there. 
However I think a lot of fingerpickers do use the strum hollow area. So I reckon it would come in handy for them.

I built my first dulcimer before I had ever seen or heard any played, after reading a page in a homesteading book on how to build them. I sort of just assumed the strumhollow is where you strum. Once I watched a couple videos about antinodes I realized I should strum in the middle of the string, and once I watched some dulcimer videos I realized most players strum about 1/4 the way up the string from the bridge. Most players agree the strumhollow is just not the sweet place to strum. For a while I stopped adding them, and instead would just hollow out the channel on the underside of the fingerboard all the way down to the bridge. It worked terrifically and probably was much more structurally sound than a strumhollow due to the shape. Sometimes on quicker builds I will even just drill a few holes where the strumhollow would be, to reduce the mass of the neck without sacrificing so much structural integrity. What do y'all think? is there any value to a strumhollow other than just to reduce some of the wood off the fingerboard? Is extending the channel on the underside just as effective as adding a strum hollow? Is drilling holes like on this strumstick as effective?

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The first three dulcimers I made for practice were exactly identical in materials and dimensions, but one was unprotected craftboard, one had just enough of a poly stain mix to coat the surface, and the third had a heavy few coats of poly forming a shell around the wood. These three were all made from craftboard so not exactly identical grain or anything, but the difference in the three was stark. The bare craftboard has by far the softest most mellow tone, and the one with a heavy poly coat is very twangy and bright, while the one with a modest amount of poly falls in between. The one with the most poly is loudest, and the one with exposed wood is the quietest, also. My assumption has been that because the poly is stiffer than the wood, the more i add, the more the tonal quality resembles a stiffer type of wood. I dont know how this would translate to harder types of wood. Maybe if it were a wood that is stiffer than the poly it would actually dampen the sound?

@Ken-Hulme & @Dan Those instruments look great!  It'd be fun to have a go at playing them.  

I've been working on a yet unnamed original tune and am playing it mostly on my Blue Lion Jean Ritchie model instrument.  Playing mountain dulcimer is a comfort in these days.  

I have been working on several songs, but I'm really enjoying my version of "Beauty and the Beast". I got Bing's original tab, but revised it some for my playing style, which I really like. Such a pretty tune. It sounds wonderful on my Doug Berch Standard Dulcimer, but it is also beautiful on my Folkcraft Custom Baritone. 

Though I don't have a particular favorite dulcimer to play, somehow I found myself really enjoying the simple melody of a hymn called "Oh God Almighty Father". It brings to mind many fond memories of my seminary years and indeed makes me feel quite peaceful. It's kind of like meditative prayer when I am playing it.

I've been concentrating recently not on a single song but a whole bunch of songs from the American west around the mid-19th century: Strawberry Roan, Lorena, Billy the Kid, Green Grow the Lilacs, and The Maid of Monterey.

That is impressive. A couple of years ago I did build a hurdy gurdy and I think I enjoyed the challenge of building of it more than anything else.

No, just my own design, "keep it simple" two string, ten key.

The wheel fiddle looks really nice Dan .... was it built to a specific plan?

Wheel fiddle I made out in the shop a short time ago, been working on an embellished Go Tell Aunt Rhody because it is an easy tune.

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Sorry, I don't have a sound clip.  I need to sit down and make some, one of these days...

Ozark Coffin specs:

26" VSL
Strung for Bagpipe Ddd or Ccc tuning
5" wide
33" overall length
1-3/4" deep; 3 wood button feet for playing on possum board or table

Brian and I once stayed in Burnsville for a couple days.

Ken what's the VSL on that little stick?  Do you have a clip of it being played?  It looks small like an epinette?  How do you like to keep it tuned?

Thankee Ma'am!  

I had intended to take it to the Berea Gathering this year, and our friends had intended to come home (bringing my dulcimer) after a week in NC, not five.  All's well that ends well

Since our friends' house is just 'up the hill' from Burnsville, NC, I'm going to build one of my Burnsville Holly Leaf dulcimers to send back up there the next time we go.  Seems appropriate, anyway!

@ken-hulme that's a very purty walking stick!

Right now it's "Star of Bethlehem," not the carol, but the fiddle tune from Alabama (I think.)  I've been playing my Jeremy Seeger, cherry top, mahogany body, no extra frets, tuned DAA for now.