I  agree with Lisa here.  I was, and still am, put off by the copycat nature of the New ED -- right down to Discussion Titles.   I wish them well, certainly.  But there was a dulcimer site that started last year and basically died within a couple months because hardly anyone was contributing.  

The thing that keeps me from joining the New Everything Dulcimer is the secrecy of the site-owner/administrator.  That just doesn't sit well with me.  Having been burned on a few dulcimer things, I'm taking a "wait and see" attitude for now.  

I, too, send the new Everything Dulcimer site best wishes!  My life is crazy with still having caregiving responsibilities and I can't join another forum yet I am sure the new ED will offer lots of good things to the lovers of all things Dulcimer.  

Thank you Strumelia for your clear and wise words here.   I can't count all the things I've learned on this site.  I used the E.D. site mostly for the fast way I could get old songs in notation and words.   Maybe that will happen again.  Thank you for owning this site.  Thanks to all who moderate and communicate here in.   aloha, irene

For clarity's sake, a few things should be noted:
At the time everythingdulcimer closed, Bruce Ford its creator announced he was shutting the site down and deleting the forums rather than choosing to hand it all over to new owners. He had his valid reasons. It was indeed a sad day for so many of us when Bruce's site closed.
The person starting this new site has posted the "About" information that they purchased the everythingdulcimer .com domain in an online auction once it was no longer owned by the original everythingdulcimer owner/creator (i.e. Bruce no longer wanted to keep paying for the domain, and let go of his ownership of the domain name). Unpaid domains typically are made available to anyone interested in buying them. Often they just become advertisement click sites that can have nothing (or something) to do with the original domain's subject matter.  That's just how the internet works.

This new person decided to use the everythingdulcimer domain name and to call their new dulcimer site everythingdulcimer, the same name Bruce Ford created for his site.  They seem to indicate they will also be adding the tabs from Bruce's old everythingdulcimer site, which Bruce kindly made available for download to anyone needing tabs.  As the new ED site owner makes clear in their About section, this new site is not affiliated with Bruce Ford or his old everythingdulcimer site .  Originally, they began a site they called DulcimerJam, but they've now switched to using the name EverythingDulcimer instead.

We wish them well! ... after all who doesn't like as many dulcimer related websites as possible? 
The Everythingdulcimer Facebook page is another existing venue enjoyed by many, which is not connected to this new everythingdulcimer site.
It can get confusing, but there are now four sites to keep distinct in our minds when it comes to "everythingdulcimer" (for those like me who like to keep track of such things, lol):  The original website created and owned by Bruce Ford, now gone.... the Everythingdulcimer Facebook page which was created as an offshoot of the original site for people who like FB, still active.... the DulcimerTab .com site which offers all the old ED site's TAB in addition to adding new tabs over time plus the Teachers and Events section like ED used to have.... and now this new 'everythingdulcimer' site as well. I'm sure the new site will grow quickly, particularly because of the familiar and long respected name and domain.

I do think it'd be good if the new site's owner would actually identify themselves a little more... I like it when sites do that. 

I'm Strumelia, I'm located in New York state. I started playing the dulcimer about 22 years ago and was an active member of Bruce Ford's everythingdulcimer site for about fifteen years, also the "SweetMusic Digest" before that. I started Friends of the Mountain Dulcimer ( FOTMD.com ) ten years ago and I run it with the help of several dedicated volunteer moderators who are very generous with their time and assistance on the site.  You can contact me directly anytime by email at the link at the bottom of every page here.  I'll respond right away with site help if you need it.  I wish I could give my real full name here, but alas I must discourage stalking incidents ...because Internet.  So I generally just go by 'Strumelia' here on FOTMD. 

Best wishes to the new mountain/hammered dulcimer site!

Yes, Rain Dog, the new site began on January 13, 2020. It is starting to be populated by former members and new folks.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Yes, I, too am very grateful for the time and energy Ron and Ken put into ED.  I'm glad you are both here, though, so we can continue to share our passion for the humble folk instrument we love so much.

I appreciate the time and effort Ron & Ken put into ED and am also glad the fellows are members here!  

Both Ron Zuckerman and Ken Longfield deserve our thanks for the work and dedication they put in as ED's Moderators/Admins when Bruce wasn't around (which was often, lol).  Well done, Ken and Ron!  

Ron's correct about the value of being able to search/find past content about specific subjects or people.

For example, if you want to find something you vaguely remember being posted on FOTMD concerning Tennessee music boxes, you can punch in:  TMB "Tennessee music box"
into the site search box and it pulls up this:

https://fotmd.com/search/results/all/1/25?search_string=TMB+%22Tennessee+music+box%22

Or do a search for:  fingerpicking fingerpicked

and you get this:

https://fotmd.com/search/results/all/1/25?search_string=fingerpicking+fingerpicked

Or if you search only within the Forums for: "Richard Farina"   you will get this:

https://fotmd.com/forums/forum?search_string=%22Richard+Farina%22

The amazing ED forums had 16 years' worth of discussions and valuable information on dulcimers, contributed by hundreds of passionate and thoughtful people.  

I agree with you Dusty. Ron, I appreciate all you did at ED. I know we had a chore keeping things running smoothly; especially guarding against malicious attacks and posts. I appreciate Bruce's creation of ED and his constant attention to it's development in the early days of the site.

We have a wonderful site here at FOTMD. I trust that all of us will continue to support it and Lisa as it continues to grow.

And who know what new developments will arise in the future.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Bruce's explanation for why he chose not to hand off ED to someone new makes a lot of sense. The platform was indeed dated and vulnerable for that reason.  It's sad to see the site go , but the music plays on. 

I appreciate you saying that, Adrian, but I think the original ED was better in a lot of ways. Facebook really doesn't have a good concept of permanence. By that I mean that you can't find something in the same place every time. Have you ever tried to find a Facebook post and had difficultly locating it again weeks or months after the original post? Also, you can't keep content like tabs, articles, etc. on there easily, and it doesn't seem to be searchable like the discussion forum was.

The EverythingDulcimer .com site has now shut down.  If you have bookmared the discussion forum, you'll no longer find anything there.

As he said he would do, Bruce very graciously made sure that folks can download for themselves all the site's TABS, Articles, Events, Club Listings, and Teacher/builder/performer Listing .  You can just click on the links he left for this and you'll be downloading a zip folder containing all the desired content. 
To read Bruce's message and get the links, go to the domain's main page here:

http://everythingdulcimer.com/

One word of advice I would add is that if you want to keep some of that content Bruce linked to, you should download it now... because he likely will not keep the page with the links and explanation there forever.

Bruce did not hand over the ED forums to someone else, and he explained his reasons there, which I think make a lot of sense.

As most of you know, the ED Facebook page will continue on, and is run by Ron Zuckerman, who is now also a member of FOTMD (welcome Ron!)

I know we are all very grateful to Bruce for having given us a wonderful place to connect, discuss, and learn about dulcimers for 16 years. That's a long time to run an interactive site.   

Hi all,

I'm sorry I hadn't see this thread again until recently, but I am glad Lois and others were able to download the site successfully.  Also glad the tab from ED has found a new home on the web.  :)

I wanted to remind folks to check their everythingdulcimer.com private message INbox and Sent box etc, to save any important private messages  in your ED account that you might not want to lose.  Only 4 days left...     

Literal tears that the TAB is available!  THANK YOU ever so much, with all my heart.

Thank you Dusty, and thanks to Kevin Teague for his hard work and dedication doing this.

I just want to let everyone know that all the tablature from ED has already found a new home:  http://dulcimertab.com/ .  The site owner is hosting everything for free and may create a database of dulcimer groups and dulcimer teachers.

Thank you, Nigel.  You, Dusty, and Brian helped get me there.  I felt a wee bit guilty taking over the Timeline with my problems instead of Private Messaging, but figured it both helped me succeed and maybe helped a few reading it all.

I don't think Bruce is interested in having anyone take over Everything Dulcimer, or I would have heard something by now.

Glad it worked for you, Lois. 

Oh my heavens!  I have it!  I do...I was just about to start all over and found something that sent me to my C drive (I thought I had bypassed that to save space) and there's something called My Web Sites.  Yes, Nigel, it even has an index.html!  5 KB and all.  <sigh!>  I'm surely not the only one to be this confused, but I'm sooooooo relieved.

Thank heavens their site stays up until June!

I really think something didn't work.  Tried to send a screenshot, but the file attachment says it failed.  The address line is weird, too: file:///C:/Users/lois-/Documents/Website%20Ripper%20Copier/Downloads/Everythingdulcimer/evartdulcimerfest.org/index.html

I think it's time to start over...oh joy!

It would appear that the software might not have worked properly but before you do any more deleting try another search for a file called - index.html

I can confirm that a search I have just made shows that such a file is on my computer and specifically relates to ED. If you do not have this file, delete everything and start again. You still have lots of time.

That produced a Notepad of computer language for Carbonite and a few things from Website Ripper, related to old searches I did about the Evart festival on Everything Dulcimer, but I tried Website Ripper and when it didn't work well I deleted the app.  Then I succeeded in finding the way to HTTrack (my first search hadn't turned it up) since that had worked for Brian.  If
"index" doesn't appear, I'm worried.  HTTrack is on my computer.  I also know it was the one copying all night long and this morning.  I just now stumbled into a list of those files Website Ripper tried to copy last night at around 6.  They're empty, but the titles are still there.

Opening HTTrack produced a list of Documents and that's where the Website Ripper list was apparently until I deleted the program. 

Lois, do a quick search for "index" files on your computer. If the copying has worked, one of them will open up the HTTrack software when it is clicked. 

I just sent off a question to the HTTrack Forum and certainly agree I'm inexperienced in using their software.  If I hadn't seen it downloading over all those hours, I would believe it didn't download.  My flashdrive shows a 2 KB WRC file, but when I try to open it, it just keeps trying to have my browser save it.  That may have been where I went astray in my initially telling it to open there, but now I can't seem to figure out how to open it any other way.  I've tried a variety of programs supposedly able to open WRC files and have nothing even close to Nigel's experience.

Dusty is correct and the cloned website will be opened by the same software which copied it. I used HTTrack and my project was saved as Dulcimer1, an arbitrary name, and it was directed at a folder named "My Websites". When the operation had finished there were five items in the "MyWebsite" folder. Two were GIF files, one was a folder called Dulcimer1 which held many files, a file named Dulcimer1.whtt and a file called "index".When I clicked on "index" the HTTrack program opened and and a purple banner type thing opened. The project name was shown in it and when this was clicked the ED website opened up.

You will have noticed that we have all shown different figures relating to the size of the ED dowload. I believe that this is due to the fact that we are all inexperienced in using the HTTrack software. I have not checked every single item on my captured website but have no reason to believe that I am missing anything. I downloaded the ED site to my hard drive directly and think that this is preferable to downloading it to a flash drive. This is because it guarantees a connection between the download files and the HTTrack software which allows it to display the captured site.

WIN HTTrack.  I can see the flashdrive and find the copy, but opening it is still a mystery.  Right now I could say the attached jpg pretty well describes my feelings...it doesn't open anything on my flashdrive, but it's a picture of me.

computer-error.jpg  •  12KB

Lois, what software did you use to download ED?  Either that software will be used to open it, or they have instructions somewhere about what to do.

O.k. here's a clue that's probably important.  My download has an extension of .wrc.  I just did a quick search on Google and will see where that gets me.

Hi Dusty & Marc & Brian, et al (including anybody here named Al),

I started downloading to a flashdrive back when I wrote 17 hours ago.  It finally has finished and it was going up until a few minutes ago as I got home and checked.  At that time I saw it was somewhat over 4 1/2 GB which is why I chose the flashdrive I used.  BTW AVG complained at me 3 times about some malware -- I think it was Smiley something or other.  Each time I clicked off, since it was stopped and I didn't want to do a scan or anything else while doing the site mirroring.  For most of that time only the download was happening.

I can see ED is on the flashdrive, but when I go to open it, I'm asked what app I want to use to open it.  DUH! I haven't a clue.  My browser doesn't open it.  Now what?  I don't even know enough to know what kind of an app I need.

Computers!  There's always something more to learn!

Marc, the download will happen faster if you download everything to your hard drive.  You can always move it to a flash drive after that.

Hi Marc, I tried putting the various named apps in at the Google Playstore and got nowhere, then went looking for website copiers.  At one point I downloaded a "free" copier only to find it needed me to move up to a licensed, a.k.a. paid, copier.  This is the link,  https://www.httrack.com/ , to take you to the copier Brian named.  Maybe I was slow figuring it out, but probably I'm not the only one.  Can't give a final word on all this as it has only been running for 8 minutes with 180 some files copied. 

I will say check your flash drive's Properties first to be sure how much space exists.  Along the way I found a few flash drives with forgotten information.

Hi @marc-mathieu. I didn't actually do it myself. I was reacting to the comments @brian-g made after he downloaded the entire site.  He used a website copier program called HTTrack, but in his comments below he lists several other programs that do the same thing.  Those programs don't just download files but reproduce the entire website.  And I'm still amazed it is all less than 4GB.  I have a small jump drive half the size of my pinky that holds 128 GB and I've used about half that memory already.

(bump)

I downloaded the articles on a thumb drive, just in case . It did not take long.

Joe

Lois, I'm not privy to any inside info, but I really believe that Bruce will make sure that *IF* the ED forums shut down, that at least the static content such as articles and Tab will be relocated and available online somewhere "in perpetuity" as he put it.  Bruce has indicated that this is his intention, and we have no reason to doubt it.

Additionally, there seems to be a bunch of people making offers to take over running the ED forums.  We don't know if/how that might work out, but it's another possible outcome.  And it seems yet others are downloading the entire site onto home drives.
I feel we need to patiently wait and see what develops.

One of the things I love about FOTMD & the dulcimer is the frequent reminder that there's no ONE way to play.  I find that also means I keep learning new things.  Discussions here & articles at ED can be great resources that I might not currently need but want a while down the road in my dulcimer "journey".  Yes, tab is a great resource, but what is the likelihood of anyone republishing articles.

I mentioned earlier a way to find the site once it is offline, but, if not re-posted on an online site, those articles won't be found in a search engine like Google.  You will only know about those articles by searching the old ED site on the "Wayback Machine."

DRAT!  Sure would love to see those articles move here or somewhere else in an active site.

Susie, I'm sure the location of the tabs from ED will be well posted by many, no matter how the scenario plays out.  

When that is done, can you share the link to the location of the tabs? 

Again...  Bruce Ford says he will keep ED's Tab files available online for everyone to use, and no need for everyone to download all the Tabs.

You da man Dusty, with yer superpower little jump drive!    

I'm still amazed that I could get all of FOTMD and ED on a little jump drive in my pocket.  Wow!  I feel so powerful! 

Yep -- back when a chip was a real chip!

Ken, wasn't that when they were making floppies out of stone tablets?   

When I got involved with computers, a Megabyte was phenomenally large!!   

Hey I remember when 4 GB was considered HUGE... :D
ED is mostly a PHP forum, and text does not typically take up that much in terms of server size. Because of our multimedia content, FOTMD currently uses 23 GB of our 48 GB dedicated server.  If I wanted to put fomtd on a smaller/cheaper 24 GB server, we wouldn't have room for any new members or content, and I'd have to remove a bunch of content and members to allow for normal growth.

Dusty - it's tough to say because I was at work when the process was finished. I also did not realize that, although I was using a very fast computer I was accidentally connected wirelessly. Therefore, my transfer speeds were very slow, and the time wouldn't really be representative anyway.

I can state, though, that with that slow connection I was averaging about 25 kb/s, and last time I looked I had downloaded 84% of the site in 13h, 20m (using no more than 4 active connections).  A fast wired connection would dramatically reduce that time, and for someone just interested in the tunes, they total what, a little over 200MB?  That wouldn't take much time at all.

Thanks, Brian. Just out of curiosity, how long did that download take?

I'm actually surprised.  Less than 4 GB for the whole thing.  Makes me wonder why servers have to be so big.

I promised to post final results, so here's what I have;

Total Website Size: 3.66GB

Number of files: 82,247

Number of Folders: 3,063

I know many people are interested in the tunes, specifically, so here's some information on that;

Tab PDFs: 1,397 files, 90.7 MB

Tab GIFs: 7 files, 268 KB

Tab JPGs: 15 files, 3.68 MB

Tab Word files: 6 files, 101 KB

Tab RTF Files: 2 files, 8 KB

MIDI files: 694 files, 2.43 MB

MP3s: 107 files, 123 MB

Lyrics Text files: 270 files, 716 KB

Folks, just a reminder about Strumelia's reminder.  From what Bruce has said, it is likely that even if ED is shut down, the stable content (tabs, articles, etc) will likely still be available.

Hello Joe,

It is quite a big job to download the entire website because you download its structure as well as its content  (tablature, articles, classifieds, etc).

I have already downloaded the site and have discovered that there are only 970 tablature files. PDF files are small and the whole lot of them take up only 82.2 MB. (I have not had the time to check the "articles".)

I am new to this forum but very experienced in forums generally having been on many, at different times, for the best part of twenty six years. As a newcomer, I am reluctant to make suggestions particularly as my announcement here of the proposed closure met with a response which I regarded as being rude. That post and my reply to it have been removed, presumably by moderators.

So, it is not for me to tell forum members what they should do. I would imagine that the site owner and moderators have already discussed the implications of the future closure and I should be grateful if they would offer some guidance on what may, or may not be, discussed here in relation to it.

How can I download all of the tabs and articles to a flash drive? I do not know how to clone the site as Brian G. did.  I have a MacBook Air with 128 gig.

Joe

Hi Jim,

I'll post my final results when I'm done, but as of right now, we are at 2.46GB, 69,150 files written, and elapsed time of 13h, 20m (using no more than 4 active connections).  I am using a very fast computer (overclocked i7-7700k CPU, liquid cooled, 32 gigs RAM), but am also using a wireless connection (that was an oversight on my part - my cable for hardwiring my connection is actually plugged into another computer nearby I was testing recently and I didn't notice it until now) so my transfer rate is pretty slow ~25kb/s).

Also, as I mentioned in my initial post (and Nigel also wrote below), this type of software is doing more than simply downloading. It actually parses the HTML files of websites and rebuilds the original site's directory and link structure. The result is that you can then load a page of the mirrored website in your browser and browse the site just as if you were doing it online.

Having read the banner on the "ED" site I posted a notice here. Then, I set to work cloning the website. The owner of the website had given his implied consent for copying. I used HTTrack and I believe that I now have the whole site intact on my local computer.

The figures for me were as follows :

Computer using i5 processor and download speeds of 45 Meg

Website Site = 2.3 GB

976 Folders

57,617 files.

The software is "mining" software and it does more than just download data. The data is downloaded repeatedly as the website is reconstructed on your computer. In my case I think the whole operation took just over ten hours to complete.

Brian, did you (or anyone else) download Everthing Dulcimer and if so what was the folder size?  This information would be useful with respect to the capacity of the external device contemplated.

Hi Irene. Yes, you can choose the output location for the files, so you can specify to an external drive such as a USB thumb drive or an SD card, as long as it's big enough to hold the contents of the site you're trying to "mirror" (ie, copy).

great news.  however, I have an older computer and way slow internet.  bummers.  Could it all be downloaded to a THUMB DRIVE?  I could have a friend do that and then I'd have all those tunes, and so much good info on building dulcimers and etc.  Why can't someone else take it over?   aloha, irene

The Wayback Machine is a great resource, but because our site of interest (ie, EverythingDulcimer.com) still currently exists, there's a better option - use a website copier program to simply download the entire website to your hard drive.

Properly configured, programs like this will rebuild the entire website locally, with all of the tab, mp3s, midis, articles, etc.  This takes a long time to do (as in hours in the case of EverythingDulcimer.com), depending on your internet speed and how "beefy" your computer is, but if you set it up and run it before you go to sleep, or before you head out to work, you may never notice. And it's a whole lot faster/more efficient than going through hundreds of tab files, articles, etc. to decide which ones you might like to keep and then downloading those individually. 

I use HTTrack because it's free and has a pretty good interface (as far as these types of programs are concerned).  But there are others that will also do the job, including WebWhacker, SiteSucker, SurfOffline, Grab-A-Site and more.

Thanks so much for all you teach here, including a way to find old sites closed down.  I read his letter as to why he's closing down and it's so understandable.  I'm sure we all wish Bruce the BEST in where he puts his time and efforts.  aloha, irene

Don't forget, Bruce did write the following:

"We have some great resources like our tablature, articles and other items not directly associated with a user account that needs a place to live. I’m going to look for options of how best to make these resources available in perpetuity."

Bruce may well be making plans to house the Tabs and articles someplace online himself.

John, I see over at ED that one person has volunteered to take the site over, but I'm not sure everyone understands how much work is involved and how much technical savvy it requires.  A team of people with the right range of expertise might be able to do it, but the number of people who have that expertise, have the time available, and have an interest in dulcimers is pretty low.  I have not given up hope that the right group of folks might step forward, but I also think that the rest of us with our own websites will have to be more involved in the future to fill the large void ED will leave.

Perhaps a member, or a group of members, can consider taking the reins of ED in the future?  Is this a possibility?

Thanks for the link, Dusty.

Yes, the tab archive at ED was a great resource for beginners. I learned a few tunes that way when I was first starting out before I gained the confidence to figure songs out on my own.  I do hope that database is retained somehow.

But everyone should know that ED is not the only site to maintain free dulcimer tablature.  I list 9 such sites on the Resources page of my website, and I'm sure there are others.  (If you know of any, let me know and I'll add them.)

So sad. That like this site has been a breath of fresh air for those who love the dulcimer. Will sure miss the tabbed music.

Kusani, I was just as surprised as everyone else to find out about this today.  Right now, everybody (myself included) likely needs some time to wrap their heads around it all.  In any case, it's not really my place to insert myself into.

In the meantime, as others have suggested, people should take the time to download whatever Articles they are interested in on ED, and probably also a good idea to just take an hour or three to go through the TAB collection there and download your favorites.  Saving your favorite articles and TABs will go a long way towards feeling a little more grounded.  Lois' reminder is also good, in that most pages on ED will be still somewhat accessible through the internet archive.

The tab there is what lots of players want, but I just fell into a 3 year-old discussion here about tunings.  It mentioned a DAA chord chart that went into several keys.  A search sent me to a discussion on Everything Dulcimer by Stephen Seifert as he was developing a new handout about DAA chords.  From there I went to his website & his 3 charts.  I am pretty sure I've downloaded it in the past, but just to be sure I printed it out again.  Since the site won't really plan to add anything, now's the time to prowl Archive.org on Feb 24, 2018 to see if it's complete.

I've also found the more people prowl a site there, the easier it stays to find it.

Strumelia, is there any way you, we, could pick up that site if no one else does?  I believe it is the most important website for tabbed dulcimer music; not to mention the wealth of general information. 

Thanks for posting this site. I just tried it out, great.  They are up to Feb 24, 2018 at this time.

It may be an alternative the ED admins could use/recommend if necessary.

I just went through the articles on ED and downloaded those that I thought I might want to review in the future.  Ron Z has posted that he is no longer accepting any new content (articles, tab, events, members, etc.) so what we see there now is all there will ever be.

I'm shocked by this news. 

Everybody needs to get good at using the "Wayback Machine" at  https://archive.org/ .  By the time it shuts down we need to locate the date with the most complete scan of the site so that people can go to that date to prowl for an article or tabs.

As a storyteller I do that with a site that was a rich source of story suggestions but no longer is online.

Here is where you can get more info:

http://everythingdulcimer.com/discuss/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=34074

and here:

http://everythingdulcimer.com/ed_end_of_life.pdf