Forum Activity for @john-gribble

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Both those look like very nice instruments. The Merlin/Woodrow fretting system allows for two octaves (major scale only) when one plays across the strings. The low octave starts on the "bass" string, crosses over to the middle string on the fifth note for three notes, and ends on the high string. The second octave is entirely on the first string, one fret at a time, traditional dulcimer style, starting on the open string. One can do some nice chording with it, too.

As for Dusty's objection to no "6th" fret, but only a "6+" fret, the 6th fret would confuse the issue of a purely diatonic instrument. How it differs from the traditional dulcimer is with the number one note of the scale on the open string. As something of a traditionalist who likes the 5-5-1 tuning, I sometimes find the 6+ fret a nuisance.

updated by @john-gribble: 04/15/19 09:43:22PM

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

I believe so................check out the you tube demo's etc. here...............there are a slew of tunes etc. on YouTube.........demos, lessons etc.

https://www.youtube.com/user/woodrowmusic

updated by @salt-springs: 04/15/19 07:55:49PM

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Wow!  These are amazing instruments!  I wonder if they are all dulcimer frets -- I need to check them out.

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

http://thewoodrow.com/

 

Worth a look.............

Berea Traditional Dulcimer Gathering Update

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

I, too, wish I could make it! 

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

I've been dreaming of an Olympia Walkabout dulcimer for years, but I haven't sprung for one yet. https://olympiadulcimercompany.com/products/

Many "cigar box guitars" have 3 strings and a diatonic fret pattern.  The easiest ones to build have no frets at all and you play them with a slide.  Anything is possible!  http://cigarboxguitars.com/

There are a lot of decent and inexpensive baritone ukuleles on the market now.  I got a Kala "Makala" for 80 bucks at Sam Ash and it plays great.  Warm tone, nothing like a banjo-ish strumming stick.  Four strings, 19-20" VSL.  Normally tuned DGBE (like 2/3rds of a guitar) but the strings will take DGAD and (usually) DAAD tunings.  Or just remove the G string and tune it DAD.  Nylon strings instead of steel, which is a plus ergonomically. 

The chromatic fretboard is a dealbreaker for some folks, but creative use of masking tape can mark the frets to ignore (or the frets to use) and sometimes that works well enough.  I think it's worth a try, given that diatonic guitar-neck instruments with a rich sound are hard to find, while bari ukes are everywhere.

 

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

I'm sorry to hear Ken's description of the shoddy construction of the Seagull Merlin.  I have a Seagull 12-string guitar that is very nice (exceptional for the price) and made in Canada. The only Merlin I played (for a total of 3 minutes) had a slightly bigger and warmer sound than other strumsticks, but it oddly has only a 6+ and not a 6 fret. And it only has a total of 7 or 8 frets, so you only have one octave to work with.  The price is about that of a student model dulcimer, so I don't see it as having much of a purpose at all. If, as Ken states, many of them are not playable due to misplaced frets, it's a real shame.  No wonder you see so many on Ebay.

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

I love all the ideas for modifying instruments.  This must be how new instruments get invented!

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Thanks for the plug Ken. Unfortunately I'm not building the Strumdrop American Cittern at this time. In my few years absence from building I have lost my jig/form for building them and haven't got around to making another.

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

A modified octave mandolin/Irish bouzouki might be a possible solution. Unwanted frets can be removed and the slots filled. You could choose whether to modify the peghead or not--it wouldn't make any difference in playing. The nut and  bridge may need to be modified to accommodate whatever stringing configuration you settle on. If you can find a used instrument at a reasonable price, the cost of the modifications shouldn't be too high.

Berea Traditional Dulcimer Gathering Update

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Ah, I wish I could be there.

Berea Traditional Dulcimer Gathering Update

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

You read here about our impromptu Gathering last year.  This year we're inviting every interested traditional player to have fun with us.  You can check out what we're doing this year at Berea College in Berea, KY May 16-19th at Dulcemore Dan Cox's website:

If you plan on attending, we need to know -- by April 30th -- how many are coming and how many are staying on-campus.  We have to give the College a head count on May 1st.   Go to the website and register ASAP, please.

updated by @ken-hulme: 04/15/19 07:46:17AM

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

A great many of the Seagull Martin instruments have had serious fret problems -- missing frets, grossly misplaced frets, etc.  They appear to be made 'offshore' by factory people who don't know and don't care.  The company apparently makes pretty good guitars, but their 'stick instruments are just not very good.  I've seen 3.  One only had 6 frets (!),  one had badly spced frets, and the third was just OK.

The sound was typical 'stick instrument, certainly not 'guitarish' like the OP is lookin for.

updated by @ken-hulme: 04/15/19 07:06:11AM

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Perhaps a Seagull Merlin would be appropriate?  http://www.seagullguitars.com/en/products/m4

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

I'm just speculating here, but perhaps you should consider a tenor guitar.  However, I'm not sure anyone makes one with a diatonic fretboard like a dulcimer.

Like many mountain dulcimers, tenor guitars have four strings.  You could always restring one to reflect your favorite dulcimer tuning.  The only hangup would be getting used to the chromatic fretboard, which would have both advantages and disadvantages.  

As KenH has stated, the more you modify the original design of the traditional dulcimer the more you move away from what would normally be called a dulcimer.  The changes suggested above would result in a hybrid instrument that is part dulcimer and part guitar.   It's already been done by combining dulcimer and banjo features into a "banjimer" or dulcimer and dobro features into the "dulcibro".  There's nothing stopping you from modifying a tenor guitar into a chromatic guitar-like dulcimer.  Good luck with your search and let us know what you decide and how it works out.   You may be on to something.

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Bobby's Cittern has a diatonic fret scheme like the dulcimer.  American Cittern is a name that Bobby and I came up with for an instrument that he was designing and building.  He doesn't have anything on his site, but I'm sure he still has pictures of what he made.  Cittern is the name of an old Renaissance instrument with a diatonic neck that was not a proto-guitar, not a lute or any other instrument.  It has a nearly round body a couple inches deep and perhaps 14" in diameter.  

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

The banjo-esque sound comes from the shallow body.  If you want a more rounded sound, look for a deeper body.  For example, compare the sound of a McSpadden v the sound of a Folkcraft or Blue Lion.  When playing an instrument in the underhand "guitar" style, you will find many of the chord/melody riffs of a mountain dulcimer impossible.  You simply do not have the same reach as the overhand dulcimer style.  Butch Ross gets around this by "playing in the box", similar to a classical guitar player.

Good luck and please post videos when you have settled on an instrument.

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

@Butch-Ross sometimes plays the dulcimer like a guitar.  He has a special dulcimer that only has half of an upper bout so that he can wrap his hand around the fretboard. Check out this video .  I think he had it custom-made, but I'm not sure.  He is a member here, so you might ask him.  If that design is something you're interested in, you might contact some of the luthiers here and see if they can make you a custom instrument.

I don't think putting heavier strings on a tin-sounding instrument like a strumstick will have more than a negligible effect. If you want a big, warm sound, you would generally need a pretty big box.

Let me add that I think your playing will be limited if you play by wrapping your hands around the fretboard. If nothing else, you eliminate the possibility of using your thumb.  Notice in the video of Butch Ross that although he plays standing up for that first tune, which mostly involves strumming chords to accompany his voice, in the next clip, which involves much more elaborate fingering, he is sitting down and playing a regular dulcimer. (You might also compare the 3rd and 4th tunes in the same video for the same contrast.)

updated by @dusty: 04/14/19 03:49:50AM

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Yes, the issues of a & b you mentioned - is exactly the obstacles I was running into. 

I'm interested in the cittern you mentioned (But I don't see anything on his website about it) - does that have the same type of diatonic fretboard as a dulcimer?  I looked at some youtube videos under "citterns" and the frets widths looked different than a dulcimer - so I wasn't sure. 

I would love to learn more about this instrument! :) Kate

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

ANY dulcimer can be played "stand up".  Look at the videos of Robert Force,  the grandfather of modern dulcimer playing.  He and his partner Albert d'Ossche more or less invented 'stand up' dulcimer.

But if you absolutely need a necked instrument for ergonomic reasons and you want something that is less 'banjo-like' sound, that's a tough one. 

A.  Because if it has a neck it really is not a dulcimer any more -- it's a diatonically fretted stick thing. 
B.  Virtually ALL stick things have very little sound box, and it is the internal volume of a larger sound box that gives you the more mellow sound of a dulcimer rather than the tinny sound of a banjo or stick thing. 

One possible solution is an American Cittern built by Bobby Ratliff of Slate Creek Dulcimers.  It has a relatively large body (much bigger than the run-of-the-mill stick thing) that is a nearly round teardrop shape, with a diatonic fretted neck.   Contact Bobby here:

http://slatecreekdulcimers.blogspot.com/

or through his Slate Creek Dulcimer Facebook page.  Tell him I sent you, what you're looking for, and see if he's interested.  He built a couple of these a few years back.  

 

Dulcimer-Guitar Style Options?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

What are the options for a dulcimer that is held like a guitar? So far I've found 1) Stick Dulcimers 2) Dulcitars and 3)Roosebeck Wildwood Dulcimer.  But I don't know the 'bigger picture' of what is available. I want to be able to wrap my fingers around the neck (for ergonomic reasons). Any direction you might point me? I prefer a deep rich sound (like a dulcimer) and less like a banjo. If I have to get a banjo-sound, is it possible to put thicker strings on it to make it less tinny?  I like to play slow, acoustic fingerpicking songs. 

Top/Back Thickness and Sustain?

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

I agree with Dan's suggestions.  Sustain comes from a rigid structure and light vibrating components.  In my Aaron O'Rourke Fingerstyle dulcimers I use a fairly thick top (up to 0.150) to limit the sustain so the sound doesn't get muddy with fast fingerstyle play.  The sides and back are 0.080 thick so they do add the the texture of the sound.  On soundboards, I measure the longitudinal and transverse stiffness of the plate and sand until I get the stiffness that I am looking for.  The stiffness is a lot more important than the thickness.  There is a lot of useful information in the online book "Left Brain Lutherie" if you are inclined to venture into the technical side of instrument making.

Introduce Yourself!

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Thank you all so much for such a warm welcome. I've been making mountain dulcimers and other stringed instruments since I graduated college in 1993.

These days I'm a volunteer on staff at Artichoke Music in Portland Oregon where I can be found once or twice a week doing instrument repair.

Peace!
Jack

Introduce Yourself!

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

A good job on a beautiful dulcimer!  Here's to many more!

Introduce Yourself!

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Very nice instrument, Jack. Thanks for sharing it with us.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Introduce Yourself!

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Love the rosy blonde color of that dulcimer, Jack!

Welcome to the site. 

Introduce Yourself!

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

My name is Jack. The Mountain Dulcimer has been a love of mine for many years. While I am able to play a few songs in a recognizable fashion, it's the construction of the instrument that truly enthralls me.

Here's a photo of one I made just last Christmas

Wind Instruments????

Adventures with 'other' instruments...

I started out taking clarinet lessons at age 10, I was the only boy in the elementary/junior high orchestra. They combined the kids back then, I guess for a lack of players. In the late ‘70s early ‘80s, I started fooling around on the Hohner Marine Band harps (diatonic).
Fast forward to about 1997, I started taking tenor sax lessons for about almost 2 years.

I also mess around with a recorder, pennywhistle, and ocarina.

I still have all these instruments, and I occasionally indulge myself, especially on the clarinet. I love to play the blues on the clarinet, which is a genre that is typically not associated with the instrument.

Music must be in my blood

OFF TOPIC discussions

Thank you Robin! Yes, I love that photo, because I know it’s him. My grandmother verified it 30 years ago, and I have another photo of him to verify that it’s the same man. And, his name is on the photo caption, which I cut out of the shot I posted here.

Also, I forgot to add that, the small town I live in here in PA (1300 pop.), still has their own band. The practice hall is half a block from my house, and in the warmer weather, one can here the music because they open the doors. Ah, tonight is their practice night! Maybe I will hear them. I might consider auditioning for them (on clarinet) when I retire.

updated by @jimmy-lamar: 04/08/19 06:20:34PM

Just For Fun - sayings regarding the dulcimer or music

OFF TOPIC discussions

Ah, the scene where they part after their wedding night! 

Juliet hates that the cursed lark is singing- because it means the break of dawn and Romeo must leave before he is discovered with her...

Music must be in my blood

OFF TOPIC discussions

@jimmy-lamar That's a great photo! 

Music must be in my blood

OFF TOPIC discussions

I know music is in my blood, although it skipped a couple generations. This pic shows my paternal  great grandfather who was the band leader. He is on the far left in the back row (kind of in the shadows). I don’t know if he played an instrument for sure, but he probably did. If he did, it was probably a cornet. I just noticed something this morning. If you look closely around his belt line, it appears that there might be a bell of some horn there. I never looked at it closely until today. I always thought it was a pocket watch chain. This was a small town band, which, as many of you know, were quite popular during this time period. I am not certain of the date of the photo. If I had to guess, it was around the late 1890s-1910. My great grandfather was a home builder and carpenter by trade.

updated by @jimmy-lamar: 04/08/19 09:30:03AM

Just For Fun - sayings regarding the dulcimer or music

OFF TOPIC discussions

“It is the lark that sings so out of tune. Straining harsh discords and unpleasing sharps.”

from Romeo And Juliet

Buzzing middle & base string when fretted on 2nd fret

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Glad we could be of help and that you got your issue sorted out so well!

 

Buzzing middle & base string when fretted on 2nd fret

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Issue resolved & thanks again for your comments. We're currently outside Savannah, Ga & I called Randy Wood Guitars(Bloomingdale, Ga) regarding my buzz. They told me to bring it in & there's a chance they could fix it while I wait. Well, I did & they did. The #3 feet needed reset. Randy handled it himself & charged me nothing. Great shop w/several luthiers working on all types of stringed instruments.

Hearts Of The Dulcimer Podcast In Its 4th Year

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Thanks Dusty! We enjoyed making this episode, glad you liked it.

 

 

Hearts Of The Dulcimer Podcast In Its 4th Year

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Very moving episode, Patricia.  Thank you.

Hearts Of The Dulcimer Podcast In Its 4th Year

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

Thanks Don! We were also touched by the stories. 

 

 

Buzzing middle & base string when fretted on 2nd fret

Instruments- discuss specific features, luthiers, instrument problems & questions

Thanks for the response guys. Ken, you're correct regarding how I've rearranged the strings. I was able to speak with Mike Clemmer this morning, he uses strings of different diameters than what I have & suspects that the lighter strings may be the problem. He recommends on this dulcimer that I install .010/.010/.016/.026 or.028. I don't recall if the strings buzzed when set up in the 5 string configuration. I'll let you know the results.

Hearts Of The Dulcimer Podcast In Its 4th Year

General mountain dulcimer or music discussions

This is a great episode! Interesting stories of heart touching moments.