Forum Activity for @silverstrings

I did hear back from Jim Woods and he said that those were superficial and in the wood all along. It was not a result of damage and will not get worse.  If the dulcimer was unacceptable to me, he would allow me to keep it until another one was made and shipped to me. I told him that I love the sound and wanted to keep this dulcimer instead. When asking about varnish, he told me that I didn’t need to do anything to that area of the dulcimer. If I wanted, I could use furniture polish that did not contain silicone. Old English (in the bottle) would be fine. Jim Woods of McSpadden Dulcimers was really helpful. Thanks everyone for your input, too. I have been playing the dulcimer less than a year and still have a lot to learn about these wonderful instruments!

Success!

Well, that calculator is interesting. I plugged in the length of the shortest dulcimer (25.5 inches) and it said that for the bass string I need a diameter of 0.15. The thinnest one I have is 0.20. The steel one I had tried the other day broke. Tonight, I put on the 0.20 in bronze, and it took.

I was able to tune up the middle string that was already on the instrument, whatever that was. Then I put on a 0.8 (which is what the calculator said) for a melody string.

About 30 minutes of playing later, it works. I've got a dulcimer tuned to GDG (G3, D4, G4). 

Thanks for the info on where to place the capo. I'll have to keep that in mind. And the gauge calculator will probably be useful.

Remember when using a capo that you have to push down evenly and with some force on the top before you tighten it. The strings have to be depressed as though you were fingering them or using a noter.  It might take a few tries before you get the hang of it. 

And I should specify that if you put it on top of the fret, it should be barely on top, meaning the fret should still be visible from the side of the capo. The majority of the capo should still be to the left of the fret wire. Don't put the capo centered right on top.  If I had better cameras and editing capability I would make a video about how to do that.

Tuning up is safer than tuning down, for the worst that can happen is that you'll break a string!  I use a wound .020 as the bass string on both my smaller dulcimers made by Ron Ewing.  One is an octave dulcimer tuned to D and the other is what Ron calls a "baritone dulcimette," which is about the size of a Ginger and tuned to G or A.  But they are both significantly smaller than a standard dulcimer, so I am not surprised your string broke.

If you are trying to tune a standard dulcimer to tonal ranges it was not originally intended, you might consult the Strothers String Gauge Calculator . You indicate the VSL and the note you want and it determines the correct gauge for you. It errs on the light side, so feel free to go one or two sizes heavier.

I'm hoping to tune up. I think that would match a mandolin. A ginger would be a logical choice, but ... more money. So right now, I'm seeing if I can get by with some new strings, and talking with some string vendors.

The capo makes my instruments sound awful. But maybe I'm doing something wrong. Now having watched your video, I'll have to try again by placing it directly on the fret. Oh, and I love the 7th sound that a 1.5 fret has, too. I've enjoyed having it on two of my instruments and will have to try it on the third by placing the cap on the 4th fret.

Carrying three dulcimers isn't that big of a deal; it's less weight than my hammered dulcimer. Still, I'd expect to carry just two.

Yes, I suppose I could learn how to tune more quickly. I'd probably stay in C or G as the default; in the bluegrass group, we don't use D that often.

Thanks for the reply!

@Userno4, I have two dulcimers currently tuned either GDG or AEA.  One is a baritone dulcimer, so it is tuned a fourth or fifth below a standard dulcimer.  It is a larger instrument with extra bracing inside.  The other is 3/4-size instrument about the size of the McSpadden Ginger.  It is tuned a fourth or a fifth above a standard dulcimer.

Depending on whether you are trying to tune above or below a standard dulcimer, you will want a smaller instrument (above) or a larger instrument (below).

I would suggest keeping a tuner on your instrument and learning to retune quickly; that way you can move from D to C and back quickly enough to join songs in either of those keys. And you should be able to retune between G and A quickly as well. It's only three strings and one step.

Let me also offer another possibility for G and A: use a capo. Tuned to D, you are in G with the capo at the third fret and in A with the capo at the fourth fret.  So with a single dulcimer, you can get to C, D, G, and A pretty easily.  Here's a video I made for another discussion here at FOTMD about using a capo.

Also, the 1.5 fret aids in getting other keys. If you are tuned to D, you can also play in G with that 1.5 fret since it gives you the C natural you need.  Between the extra fret and the capo, more keys are at your disposal out of a single tuning than you might think. You don't really want to carry three dulcimers to every jam you attend, do you? It takes just about as long to put one instrument into its case and take another out as it does to retune your three strings.

I have three dulcimers. Which one should I tune to GDC?

Dulcimer 1: A Roosebeck that my mother bought me about five years ago. It's 25.5 inches from nut to bridge. I think that the 1.5 fret I had someone put in has risen a bit, which explain the tinny sound I sometimes hear. (Yes, I know it's imported from Pakistan, which brings out the haters.)

Dulcimer 2: This one is made by Michael Sanderson of Harbor Springs, Michigan, going under the name of Sylvan Music. The distance from the nut to the bridge is 26.25 inches. It's got a more mellow sound than the Roosebeck. This is the one I usually take to a dulcimer club, where everyone tunes down to to CGC. It has a 1.5 fret, which has been well-behaved.

Dulcimer 3: I bought this one at a Goodwill auction last week. It's a TK O'Brien mode 36. Like the Sanderson dulcimer, it was made in early 2011. It's 25.875 inches long from nut to bridge. It has a 6.5 fret but not a 1.5. It has a very sweet sound, especially when I strum around the 4th or 5th fret. It's probably the quietest of the three.

I'd like to move one of these to GDG because I'd like to have one for a bluegrass jam session I go to on a regular basis. I expect to take two with me, actually, one tuned in C (our autoharp player likes to play in C) and one in G (since it's a bluegrass group).

I bought some banjo strings (.20, .11, .09) and started to restring the Roosebeck with the .20. The string snapped, so I called GHS strings, the maker, and he said there must be a defect and will send me some new strings, including some thinner ones.

Any suggestions?

Thanks to everyone! I agree with every comment. I did send photos to Jim Woods and asked suggestions. If I ever need it repaired, I will go to a dulcimer luthier. It makes my heart full to know that I have such a great sounding instrument. I will definitely take great care of it. Going to let you all know what Jim Woods says in his response. He has always been great about any questions I have had in the past while making the two dulcimers that I have from McSpadden. 

If I read your post correctly, you are the original registered owner of this instrument and as such that dulcimer has a lifetime guarantee. I think I would consider sending Jim Woods the pics you posted and inquire as to what he thinks should be done to correct the issue.  It maybe that that separation around the knot may just require a bit of finish or something of that nature to secure what may simply be due to the wood aging a bit. 

I understand the tone issue you mentioned too as I have redwood/cherry and it is really outstanding and is just as balanced and bright as some that cost considerably more. 

Anyhow, what have you got to lose?

I agree with those who suggest not doing anything, at least for the time being. Other than some minor cosmetic issues, you don't yet have a problem. At this stage, your dulcimer is simply developing a little character. If the seperations turn into genuine cracks, they can be repaired.

As Bob says -- it "ain't broke" so don't try to fix it.    Especially since you don't know what Cyano Acrylate "superglue" is --  you'd be apt to glue your fingers together !  You need to ask McSpadden what they use for "varnish" -- it could be any number of things like polyurethane, varnish, shellac, various oils.  

As Bob says too, those truly do not look like cracks, they look like grain going around a knot.  Since you say there's no light coming through cracks, gluing would not help.  Those marks could have been there since the beginning, and you're just noticing them.  I don't even see any evidence of the "varnish" cracking there.

It NOT as if McSpadden, or anyone who builds dulcimers goes deliberately out of their way to hide imperfections, as your luthier suggests!  That said, darn few of us builders can afford to just cut the back off and scrap the instrument or replace it.  If there had been real cracks, McSpadden would not have sold it.  Or they would have fixed the cracks and then sold it as a defect instrument.  

Word of advice -- do not take your instrument to any old luthier for work unless absolutely necessary.  Always talk to someone who is a dulcimer builder/luthier.   Dulcimer are NOT guitars, they are not built the same way, they don't make sound the same way as guitars. mandolins and such like; and they are not 'set up' like those other instruments either.  

Silverstrings, I would offer a wee suggestion: Don't panic!

I was imagining cracks along a straight grain, but from the pics these appear to be around a knot section in the board. Are the hairline cracks actually going through the boards? If so that can be remedied. They look superficial from the photographs and I might imagine they will remain superficial. Give it time, keep it in a regulated environment like you have been, and out of the direct sunlight and see how it does. If it sings as beautifully as it does, leave it alone, it ain't broken. Instruments in far worse condition are played regularly; just be tender with it.

~Bob

Thanks, Ken. My husband, a jazz guitar teacher thought I should possibly get a replacement dulcimer. I did explain that I tried out every dulcimer by various makers at a recent festival and not one compares to the sound and balance that I get from this one. I wonder if they knew the wood had problems or that it just happened with this wood. Thoughts on that? The luthier said that there is no place to put the glue. If it gets worse, he would fix it for me. What is CA “superglue” and what kind of varnish would you suggest? Thanks Ken, for any input. My brother is an award winning sound mixer for Sony Pictures and even he says that he has never heard such a “magical” instrument! 

Not much McSpadden can do:  replace the instrument is about it.  If they put  new back on it will probably wipe out the "unbelievable tone".   

They could dribble some very thin CA "superglue" into the cracks; let that dry, and then cover with additional "varnish".  But you can do that at home just as easily and just as well.  That's what I would do.  

So, I live in North Georgia and am very careful with my Redwood/Black Walnut McSpadden. It has been a mild winter. I never leave it in the car. I take great care of it. I have only had for 8 months and noticed on the back bottom part of my dulcimer a few hairline cracks. I will call McSpadden as they made it for me. I did let my husband show to his luthier. The luthier says that sometimes makers see a problem in the grain and don’t want to remake it so they cover it up. I really love the sound and no light is coming through the wood. I want to approach the right way with McSpadden. I don’t want to give up this dulcimer and get another. The tone is unbelievable. However, I have never had this problem with a guitar. I feel like I am already very careful with this instrument. Suggestions are very welcome. I worked hard to get this wonderful instrument and can’t go out and buy another. Thanks.

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I know we have lots of members from the  greater Nashville, TN area where the tornadoes went thru...it would be good if we could  get a word on whether folks are OK, injured, rec'd damage, etc.

Not particularly indicative of an on-going problem.  Vagaries of heat and cold and humidity, and differing expansion and contraction rates of wood and metal can occasionally cause a fret to be pushed up slightly out of its slot.  A fret that is too high can cause all sorts of strange noises that are not "sweet music". 

Long ago I was living high and dry in Mile High Colorado.  I built a dulcimer for a customer who lived in sea level Alabama.  When the instrument left Colorado the frets were perfectly level.  By the time it arrived in Alabama two of the frets were raised.  Ship it back to me and the frets were level again.  Rinse and repeat.  The customer had to have the frets leveled down there at sea level; then it played perfectly for as long as it was owned. 

Doesn't happen often, but it does happen.  

Also, some people press down on the strings/frets very hard and the strings will wear notches in the surface of frets made of inferior metal. 

That's why sometimes frets have to be leveled or "dressed".  

I'm looking to purchase a Mastertone dulcimer that is used (3 years old).  It's sycamore and walnut - a real beauty that looks pristine as does the case that comes with it.  The seller mentions in their ad, however, that work by a local luthier has been done on the frets - she states they were "leveled."  My question is for what reason might frets on a 3 year-old dulcimer, which otherwise looks immaculate, need to be leveled?  I've had several much older dulcimers for a long while and never had any frets leveled, and they all play just fine.  Is the leveling of frets on an instrument indicative of some problem?

I just saw this thread - afraid I've been away from FOTMD (and the dulcimer) for too long.  I'm coming back to both.

I was very fortunate to talk with David Olney a couple of times when I worked at a public radio station in Boston that played his music and became a big fan, and caught some performances and became a bigger fan.  The breadth of types of songs he wrote is quite varied, from touching love songs to writing about John Barrymore or the Titanic (from the iceberg's point of view.)  Saw him live most recently when he came to the Portland, Oregon area where I live.  That's a fond memory.  His death came as a shock.

For years he had a weekly informal vlog on Youtube where for about ten minutes he'd update fans on appearances, maybe read a sonnet or haiku he had written, sing a song of his (or sometimes other writers he admired) and then give some background on how the song came about.  They're all still there - just search for "David Olney You Never Know"  on Youtube.

Y'all are most welcome!  I know I enjoyed watching.  

Good stuff.  Thanks for sharing this.

Thank you for the kind wishes ... If you ever saw David or would like to recall your first reaction to him as a musician, please let me know.  I would love to talk with you.  Best, Linda

I'm glad you fellows liked the piece.  I just listened to it again.  Wow.  

I love the tone of this instrument and the tune he plays.  And it's cool to hear Gary discuss the build.  

About time somebody did that. Hope you get a lot of responses and a lot of good stories.  

Hi!  I'm one of the moderators here and for your own privacy, we encourage members to share private information such as phone numbers and email addresses through private message.  

I wish you the best with your very cool project!  

Greetings fellow players.  If you knew, played with or toured with David Schnaufer, especially in the late seventies through the eighties (or beyond) I would very much like to talk with you for a biographical project about David.  I am interested from hearing from everyone, no matter how trivial you think the memory would be.  All contributions will be gratefully acknowledged.  Thank you.  

Amazing.

That's really cool, Robin. Thanks for sharing that.

What is hard for us to imagine is the majesty of those large churches. Today we are used to massive buildings. But back then, nearly everyone lived in a one-room mud-and-brick home.  The magnificence of those cathedrals must have been overwhelming.  And then if you also heard phenomenal choral music or powerful pipe organs it would have been an overwhelming experience.

Put on your headphones and shut your eyes.  :)

https://www.npr.org/2020/02/22/808404928/listen-the-sound-of-the-hagia-sophia-more-than-500-years-ago?fbclid=IwAR3qDRNITCCc5EpzyjeMYAWrLO9w76JHn1CBcunLC2ln1j4Ii_qGh6fRrjs

Thanks Ken,

Yes, maybe wasn't noticed when action was higher but as it was lowered it became very noticeable.

   I have taken care of the action on a number of my dulcimers among other repairs, but since this one needed a number of things checked over and it wasn't mine, (I was just finding a nice dulcimer for a new player) - well thought better then me working on it.

   Good to know that the frets could have raised from the change of where or how it sat for the 30+ years, maybe I should be glad it was only 3 and not more. Even frets on my own dulcimers, I have file down but again looking like a new dulcimer and not mine - I just didn't want to.

    All a journey in both playing the dulcimer and caring for it.

Thanks,

m.

ANY dulcimer that sits for more than a few days in the wrong environment can get frets popping up.  Especially if coming from a very dry climate to a very damp one.  I remember building a dulcimer for a lady in Alabama, when I was living in Colorado.  Action was perfect hen I shipped.  By the time she got three or four frets had raised as the change in humidity forced the frets up...

Action height will also affect whether frets need to be adjusted too.  Lower actions are more sensitive as it were to slight differences in fret height.  Luthiers can be more or less sensitive to whether frets need adjusting than customers as well.

It's all part of the "game" really.  The game of setting up a dulcimer to the way you like it, not the way it was necessarily presented to you.  Just like changing strings, you really should learn to do simple things like setting the action height yourself... all it takes is sand paper, a nickel, a dime, and time.  

    There was a label but no model #. It was made in the 80's and may have had the same strings on it. I took it to get new strings (I could have done that but it needed to have the action lowered also) and  be checked out. Turns out 3 frets needed to be adjusted (filed & reshaped) -   so question   -   older dulcimers depending how or where they were stored for 30+ years, could that cause some frets to pop up a bit? As much as I checked it out, I didn't notice the frets till the action was lowered. 

    All in all, I still got it for a very fair price including the pricy repairs -  but would have been a better deal without all the repairs. I have it tuned to DAA, it sounds so much sweeter then tuned DAd - for walnut I was surprise it sounded a bit bright or does older Folkcrafts tend to sound more bright then mellow? 

    The dulcimer & case looks basically new, not a scratch, chip or dent. It must of come home from the shop and made its way into the closet - and there it stayed. A treasure hiding but now it's out ;-)

Thanks for the info.

m.

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Yes, a Folkcraft, but I don't think it is a kit. The kits did not have that type of peg head.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Yes, Aubrey's amazing. She has mastered every style of clog dancing and can do it while talking, singing, playing the fiddle, or playing the banjo.  If I could dance like that I wouldn't need to go to the gym!

Thanks John,

I have google Folkcraft teardrops and yes, you are right. I will contact the seller and go check it out.

it may have a label, I just haven't seen it yet, just the photo

That is definitely from Folkcraft Instruments, however I'm not sure if it was assembled at the factory, or if somebody just assembled a kit.  It would seem likely that if it was a factory-made dulcimer, it would have labeling in or on it.