Forum Activity for @ken-hulme

When we say "a dulcimer is tuned to G (or D or C)"  what we are most commonly referring to is not the key of the song being played (as Dusty so well explains), but the fact that unlike a chromatic instrument like a guitar, we tune the whole (mostly) diatonic dulcimer to a particular keynote.  The keynote of the dulcimer is, under most circumstances and with most tunings, the note that the bass string is tuned to.  

The Ginger instruments are designed and built to be pitched up higher -- G rather than D or C.  Think of it as a soprano rather than an alto or tenor voice.  That's not to say you can't put appropriate strings on it and play in C or B.  However, the tiny volume of the body means that the instrument won't resonate as good as possible when tuned down that low.

Interesting.  Especially the folklore of the "Scottish" instrument which we know is not accurate -- the British Isles never had a dulcimer-relative instruments until the early 20th century.   Virginia is certainly one of earliest dulcimer-producing areas -- there is a dulcimer in a museum there reliably dated to 1800.  

Dana, sorry, I'm getting in to this discussion late. Dusty really covered everything in his posts. Here is the information on the Ginger from the McSpadden website: 4 String Ginger, Flat Peghead, Hourglass with Cherry top, back and sides.  Comes with a padded Teal nylon case.

McSpadden Ginger Models are smaller dulcimers with a 23 3/16” fretboard that can provide a high (Key of G) clear voice similar to that of a mandolin.  On request they can be set up in the Key of D to be used as a smaller standard dulcimer for players who have difficulty reaching positions on a standard size fretboard.  The voice remains bright and clear whichever key is chosen.  The standard setup is G-d-gg.  Optional setups are G-d-dd, D-A-dd, and D-A-AA.  Included are 6 ½ and 13 ½ frets, Teal nylon padded case, pick & noter and warranty.  When set up in Key of D a beginner instruction book is provided and for Key of G setups an extra set of strings is substituted for the book.  No case upgrade is available for the Ginger.  Other options available include:  Strap Buttons (Chrome, Black or Gold); Upgrade to Black or Gold Tuning Pegs; Squeakless Strings.

Ken

"The dulcimer sings a sweet song."

Dana, if you only change the tuning one note in either direction, you probably don't need any kind of bridge compensation.

I like those lower tunings for fingerpicking, but I also like higher tunings for flatpicking.   I would encourage you to play with your Ginger tuned to G and explore it for the different tone you get rather than trying to turn it into a standard dulcimer. And if you play with someone on a baritone dulcimer, the two of you will sound great because you'll both be tuned to the same key but one octave apart.  Yummy stuff!

Dana, my previous post didn't really explain what a key is, and maybe that's what your initial question is.

Most songs center around a single note, a key tone (often referred to as the "tonic").  You can think of that as the home base of the song.  Oh the song will meander to other notes, but it will always come back to that home base. But you can also play that song with a different key tone or a different home base.  The meandering will move to different notes, but they will maintain the same relationships to each other and to the key tone.  Think of that home base as the key.  If you play a song with your home base on one note and I play the same song with a home base on a different note, we will sound OK individually, but we will clash when we play together. Each key comes with a set of notes that are likely to be used in that song and a set of chords that are likely to be used to accompany those notes.

When you use DAd tab to play while you are tuned GDg, it works because the relationships between the notes are the same.  However, you will not actually be playing in the key of D (with D as your home base or key tone); you will be playing in the key of G (with G as your home base or key tone).  So you will clash with dulcimers playing that same tab tuned DAd.

I hope that helps. If you want more, we should probably move to the Music Theory Group and start looking at the Circle of Fifths and other fun stuff that scares people unnecessarily.

Thank you Dusty! That's some great info! Right now, I play mostly in CGC or C#G#C#. I love a lower tuning. Can I get a compensated bridge if I want to change it out?

Dana, if you tune your Ginger to GDg, you can play everything you currently do in DAd.  You will sound great. You will be in a higher register and a different key.  Everything will be wonderful and you'll have fun. You can also tune to AEa and be in an even higher register.  

Unless you start to play with other dulcimers tuned DAd, that is, for then you will not be in the same key.  There are ways to play in G out of a DAd tuning and in D out of a GDg tuning, but that requires some more understanding of keys and the fretboard.

If you tune a Ginger to DAd you probably will need different gauge strings. McSpadden surely has recommendations for string gauges for a DAd Ginger and you can also use the Strothers String Gauge calculator , inputting the VSL and the desired tuning.  That calculator errs on the light side, so feel free to use strings slightly heavier than what it indicates.

When you buy a Ginger from McSpadden, they use a slightly different bridge for DAd or GDg tunings.  Can you switch tunings without a compensated bridge?  Yes, and you might find it plays perfectly well. If you have a sensitive ear, however, you might find the intonation slightly off.  If you want to tune your Ginger to DAd, then try it and see how it sounds.  If you notice an intonation problem, you will want to get a compensated bridge.

But you already have dulcimers tuned DAd.  Why not keep this one tuned GDg or AEa so that you can play in those keys and the higher register?  I think you'll find it a refreshing change.

I just took possession of a Redwood/walnut ginger. It's very nice and has a great tone. It is tuned to G with an extra set of strings, 26, 14, 10. 

My question is...what exactly does the G tuning mean? I realize Mac has you get a compensated bridge if you want it tuned to D. But what does that actually mean?

Can I play DAD tab? How should I tune it? Do I need to change strings to play in DAD? 

Dusty? Ken? Looking for yall to chime in and let me know what exactly I have here. Thank you as always!

And here's the dulcimer

Here's a tune played on a dulcimer with diatonic/chromatic fretboard

Listen to Pastorale Michel Corrette by nickosullivan #np on #SoundCloud

https://soundcloud.com/nickosullivan/pastorale-michel-corrette

 Marg, What a lovely setting for playing!  I'm looking for similar chairs, but it's hard to find just the right height, cushiness, depth, etc.  The hunt is ON!

Thank you for responding. I did try to see if I could isolate the problem to one string, and I could not. I think I will try different strings, though, and at your suggestion, I will use lighter gauge ones. 

I don't think the instrument's sustain is a problem with the strings. You might try a lighter gauge string just to see if it changes anything, but it may just be an instrument that has a longer sustain.

For home playing, Brian and I bought these chairs several years ago, and we find them incredibly comfortable for playing music.  They are also great for throwing in the car for playing music elsewhere:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/HDX-Black-Folding-Chair-2FF0010P/204269967

We have four of them, and keep them folded up hidden behind an open door when not in use.  (our house is older so it has doors for every doorway, which is how people regulated/saved the winter heat in the old days... our modest sized living room alone has three doors! lol)

Thank you. Strumelia.

Trevor

 Blevins dulcimer

WOW, very nice

yes, how does it sound

I have little grandchildren;  so when I was looking for a chair for playing the dulcimer, I also was thinking of extra space for extra little angles. It is low & no arms, just a bit too deep but I place a pillow & all is good.

 Screen Shot 2017-08-15 at 12.59.33 AM.png - 537KB

oh I ment to add....I made the folding legs of the now wooden dulcimer table to a very low position that it's at "lap height" for me.  I know I SHOULD play the dulcimer on my lap and knees, but I love the sound of it on a table.  I have some little "stick on" little feet and the whole dulcimer vibrates nicely.  I think she's happiest on the table.  That table is 23 & 1/2 inches tall. aloha, irene

I use an 18 inch tall stool I made a long time ago, but I put my dulcimer on a table that I got from Walmart, took off the plastic top and put on a nice wood top.  I have it so it folds up.  I'm looking for a chair that folds up too, but would like a comfortable wide one.  I've repaired and made some very cute cushions for those piano stools.  Sold one for $175.00.  

Hey Ken, I've been hearing a lot about those. I don't think they're quite my thing, but this is an interesting discussion here on fotmd. thanks.

Hi Jan! Nice to chat with you. I know somebody else who plays with the dulcimer on the arms of a chair. Helps the sound ring out too! 

Hi Dulcinina, thanks for commenting! I think I'll ultimately go for one of those office chairs. Funny coincidence, but I also have an old piano stool that spins! It was my grandma's, so it is old. I don't ever really use it for anything... and I think I'd need more cushioning for my rear end anyway 

I'm trying to get back into playing my dulcimers. I have 3 that I've had for years. I've restrung all 3. One of them, built by a well-respected luthier, sings too long. That is, the sound goes on for a good 8 seconds after my hands have left the instrument, and it's distracting. When I put my hand on the wood, the sound stops. I don't want a choppy cut-off, but this is too much. I suspect I've done something wrong with the re-stringing. Any ideas? The other two don't do this. I have had the strings for a while, but they were in their original envelopes.

Trevor, I'm thinking that what you are actually asking about is this: you are going to look at Group discussions (not Forum discussions) and are seeing only the original post but not the replies by others.  That's because you need to JOIN that Group in order to see the entire discussion including the various replies, and you'll also need to JOIN that Group in order to make a post in it.  If you click to such a discussion, notice if it's a Group discussion, and if so, then simply JOIN that group and you'll then see all the replies as well as the original post for that Group's discussions.

I think I play best in my recliner with the dulcimer across the arms....

I use a triangular folding camp stool with a back when playing sitting.  

Hi Mary, I use a couple different seats.  One is an old round wooden piano stool where the seat spins up and down. But it's lowest position is about 18" and has no back. My other chair is what I call a "steno" office chair.  It's has a padded seat and back and it adjusts to various heights by a lever. It has no arms and the lowest position is 16". I got it at an office supply store on a close -out for $25.  It's on wheels, doesn't take up much room and is very comfortable. It also doubles as my sewing chair at the sewing machine. This chair is also easy on the fanny whereas the stool is not.  Dulcinina

Hi all!

I'm looking for a chair for playing at home. I seem to need something no more than 16 inches high, no arms (of course) and a back for relaxing. Do you have any favorite seats? Maybe I'll like what you like!

Sorry I've been away from fotmd for so long... My daughter had twins a year ago and life has been BUSY!  (and when she had the twins, her other two were 1 and 3 yrs old! Not complaining though. It's been a good time for this grandma!    I might start actually playing and singing again soon now that we all survived that first year!!! I've missed you folks!

Hi again, fellow compulsive dulcimer purchaser! I have a question on this Blevins dulcimer you bought. How does it sound by now? Is the intonation good? Is the sound full or tinny? Thanks!

('mountain dulcimer abuse')

No, more like another way of letting the strings ring.

(over the strum hollow for good clean strikes that don't knock wood.)

Ha, yes. I learned this quick enough. (Little Drummer Boy )  that does sound like it would be a good one for this technique.

Thanks, as always

A friend just picked up this instrument.  The fret markers and soundholes are unique.  No label inside, but "P.L. Purser Wareham, Mass" is on the headstock...  Evidence points to this being built in the 1960s/70s

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10212114415550201&set=a.1478176308940.63482.1069737994&type=3

They are your cigar boxes, do with them as you please.  I think most builders keep them right side up to show off the cigar makers labels and such.   Either way around, the insides certainly can be used for storage; but as you say, you do need to insure that they don't open spontaneously.  

Technique works really well for Little Drummer Boy and a couple other tunes I know.  You do have to keep the 'hammer' over the strum hollow for good clean strikes that don't knock wood.

I'm very tempted to call this 'mountain dulcimer abuse'

I am revisiting hammering the dulcimer strings instead of strumming. I have a wooden dulcimer hammer but it doesn't ring when I hit the strings as does a chopstick, a paintbrush, a leader drum stick and a brass tube over a stick. I think maybe the wooden hammer just  isn't heavy like the others. I am only playing slow, easy songs to start with but do like the different sound of hitting vs. strumming with some songs. Again, the different dulcimers, size, wood, etc. sound different with hitting & each has it's own tone. 

Any suggestions for hammering? Not thinking anything serious just playing around.

    I did find 3 cigar boxes that match up. I needed to go to several shops, there isn't as many cigar shops now but smoke shops. The boxes are not deep but they are made of wood. I did see some beautiful wood ones but couldn't find 3 that fit together. 

    I was thinking of turning them upstairs, seems to be a smother transition from one to the other. So now if the boxes can open on the bottom, could their insides be used as storage? I know I would need to turn the dulcimer over & also make sure they didn't just open on their own.

Hi Ann!  Yes, if you are tuned a little low (CGC) then the strings will tend to vibrate in a wider arc when picked or plucked.  This would explain why you get the buzz only when picking the string a second time, while it's still vibrating from the previous note.  Three things can help this- 

1) try tuning up one step to DAd and see if it is improved by having more tension in the strings... or,

2) stay in CGC and put on a set of strings that are slightly bigger gauge (instead of a .010 for example, try a .012 or so- this will also add a little tension and decrease the vibration arc of the strings...  and

3) Ken mentioned something about this- try picking with only the very tip of your fingerpick and not the part nearer your fingerpad. It sounds like the already-vibrating string is prematurely hitting the pick right before you actually pick your note.  Playing closer to the pick tip end would help this.

Try without the picks. I fingerpick most of the time. I like the softer sound produced and I don't get any pick noise. :) It may also help pinpoint the problem.

Ann, I have to agree with Ken that if a given string only buzzes sometimes, then the problem is probably not the string gauge. 

You might ask for help with fingerpicking technique in the Fingerpicking Group here at FOTMD.